My friend, age 79, recently went to a huge concert with her cousin, age 76. They wanted to see a group that they'd loved when they were younger. Their contacts with others were in the hotel where they spent the night, in public transportation to and from the hotel, and at the concert itself. They'd decided beforehand that they were "through with Covid and unafraid," having already had it once before, and they'd been vaxxed and boosted. They took no precautions at the concert or otherwise.
They're now both very sick with Covid. The symptoms started the day after they arrived home. Five days of quarantine and a prescription, which is making my friend miserable with diarrhea and sore stomach. Of course, the fever and coughing too. So far, neither of them has had to go to the hospital. Beware when you think of interacting with large public groups!
My friend is hoping she'll be well enough to have house guests for T'giving and is wishing she hadn't gone to the concert. Her husband nearly died of Covid a year or so ago, and she's heartsick hoping he won't get it again. So much for "being through with Covid and unafraid."
Exactly, I wholeheartedly agree with everything that you said.
My brother in D.C. traveled internationally with his job and for pleasure. He has declined significantly and isn’t able to travel out of the country anymore. His lifestyle has changed dramatically since he had Covid which is why his doctors felt that he was a good candidate for the long term NYU study.
Here’s the thing though, like you say, if people refuse to ignore science, then surely they won’t believe what comes out of the NYU study either. I will not waste my time arguing with people who are going to believe what they choose to believe.
It is refreshing to hear your intelligent viewpoint, Fawnby.
I live in an over-55 community. Some people are cautious. Others are all over the place, coughing into their hands, then opening the door to the amenity center. Lots of coughers live here. Bringing their grandchildren, who are sneezing, into the pool and rec centers. Allergies? Who knows? Doesn't matter. Whatever was in their respiratory tract is now where my 85-year-old neighbor will get it on her hands when she opens the door to the building to go in and pay her HOA fee. She's immunocompromised, but she thinks the pandemic is over and she's safe.
I learned last week that an acquaintance that I'd met on my walks died several months ago. She had Covid in 2021 and was in the hospital, then came home with home health care. She was vigorous before Covid and got well enough to walk outside occasionally, but she couldn't think well. Didn't read anymore, too foggy for that. Had lingering lung problems. Never operated on all her mental cylinders again, to the point where she couldn't take care of her pets. I miss her.
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It's a double edged sword and a lose-lose situation for me. Covid isn't as big a threat as it was 2, 3 years ago, but it's still here. However, the U.S. hasn't had 1,000 Covid deaths in one day for over a year and a half and the daily deaths have been just several dozen. We haven't had any above 150 in a single day since the spring and worldwide, the daily death count has been 200-300 with the spring being when you last had 1,000 Covid deaths in one day across the world. And all the tripledemic concerns from last year didn't materialize. Last winter was the safest one since before Covid started and the flu season in my state peaked during early December.
In the future, barring one of the death scenarios I had mentioned before popping up in the near future, my future self will be wishing either:
A) I acted sooner and maybe, with help, convince her to do PT sooner so I could salvage more of my life. Maybe try to have her do it when cases were down and hope she was willing to try. She is guilty of stubbornness and won't ditch it.
B) I waited a little longer so I could keep her from catching and dying from Covid or anything else. I would be haunted for the rest of my life if me demanding her do PT ended up being the reason she became a Covid casualty, if not a victim of the flu. I would never get over it.
The brain fog issues that are described by you and Alva are serious.
My brother has experienced this and the study at NYU is addressing this issue with him. NYU has told him that covid has caused cognitive decline in certain cases.
I don’t think some people are capable of understanding these issues because they haven’t experienced it themselves.
I have severe allergies and have struggled with bronchitis and sinusitis at times like you do. It’s miserable.
When I get asthma attacks it’s concerning because I have landed in the hospital. They send me home with a breathing machine and that definitely helps. Plus, I do have my inhaler to use.
I have had allergies since childhood but my mom wasn’t very familiar with allergies. She never suffered with allergies.
My mother thought that I got a lot of colds. I got my allergies from my dad. He suffered like I did. Neither of us knew that we had allergies.
When I married my husband, he jokingly said, “You’re not normal! You are constantly sneezing! We should own stock in Kleenex.” LOL 😆
So, I went to be tested for allergies and I am allergic to just about everything!
I went through receiving weekly shots to desensitize but I had a systemic reaction and nearly died in the ER. They placed me on steroids.
I was never able reach maintenance like some people do after getting the series of shots.
After my systemic reaction my allergist said that I was at a higher risk of getting another one so they decided to discontinue giving me injections of the allergens.
I manage my allergies as best I can with meds.
I have asthma too and have been hospitalized for it. It’s frightening not to be able to breathe.
I couldn’t agree with you more.
Nobody cares , they sneeze and cough on anyone while out in public .
I have asthma and am prone to bronchitis and sinusitis as well. And DH has diabetes . My brother in law died from Covid in Dec .2020.
DH had Covid pretty bad , I almost took him to the hospital . I had it but not as bad.
This is certainly an important, interesting and controversial topic. One that everyone has their own personal view of.
My brother in D.C. had a severe case of Covid and nearly died. He was on a ventilator and was not expected to live.
He had serious health issues before he got covid. So, getting Covid for him was quite serious.
The vaccine hadn’t come out yet when he caught it. D.C. was one of the hot spots, just like here in New Orleans.
Our outbreak in New Orleans came out during Mardi Gras. If you are familiar with our Mardi Gras you know how crowded our city becomes during the carnival season.
My brother’s doctor asked him to participate in a long term Covid study with NYU because he has a history of cancer, heart disease, pulmonary issues and diabetes.
He consented to participate in the study which will be a five year long study. He is still experiencing issues relating to Covid. So are many other people.
He lived in NY for many years before moving to D.C. and he feels NYU is excellent in their research.
My concern, like Alva’s, is long Covid. I know people who have it. I know some who have cognitive decline that they think is from having Covid, and one participates in research about that. I know 13 people who died from Covid or complications of it.
I am susceptible to respiratory illnesses and have had serious bronchitis and sinusitis from flu and colds. That all started in my 30s, which is odd because as a child I rarely had colds.
My concern is being able to take care of my husband as long as he needs me, and also for him not to decline cognitively in a more drastic way from Covid. He has dementia, so we know he’ll get worse but hope not to accelerate it. We are very careful and don’t take kindly to those who are cavalier about infecting others with anything. I’m flabbergasted that some people just don’t care (they include some of our family members, sad to say).
I live as carefully as I can still maintaining low impact of virus-thought in my life.
We have pretty decent herd immunity now. Thanks all of those willing to get it once, twice, three times. Still................I try to stay careful knowing that vaccines will not stop the virus. And I will say this. They now say good protection from vaccine only lasts four months. Are we to go for injection every four months? Because not me. I will go once a year, beginning next January. Last one was July before a trip to the PNW.
We just all need to make our own decisions now, and move on till next time, thanking the new DNA research on vaccines for quick action on this when it was a killer epidemic. Already so hard to remember those times.
We are also careful about limiting being in a large group in a closed space. Most of our public buildings here were not built with super-duper ventilation systems. Even hospitals here are now having their ventilation systems upgraded, starting with ICU units. But I’m so sorry about how Covid has changed so many things that used to be enjoyable and easy.
I am sorry to hear that your friends became ill.
Our doctor has advised that we stay up to date on all vaccinations, flu, covid and rsv.
I have had so many friends and family members who have had covid. A couple of my friends died from it. One brother who lives in D.C. nearly died. He was on a ventilator. He had Covid before the vaccine came out.
I believe in preventing as much as possible but we still have to live our daily lives.
I'm sorry they got sick - being sick does suck. But as long as they don't have comorbidities, they will most likely be fine. The one with tummy issues from the meds - she should call her doc and get a different one. I used ivermectin the 2 times I've had it and it worked like a charm with no side effects for me. Everyone is different but it's worth a try.
Your friend might want to postpone that idea of hosting Thanksgiving. As I'm planning and prepping for ours on Sunday, it is a LOT of work. Planning, shopping, cooking, cleaning, etc. etc. Even if technically recovered, she might be too tired to pull it off.
The fact is that people in nursing homes are sick and old (90% at a minimum) and yes many do want to die but they keep getting procedure after procedure to extend their lives. Many posts on here are about evil old people who are selfish and miserable so yes they should be dead because they inflict misery unto others.
Propping up the walking dead is inhumane in my opinion and for every happy person in a nursing home or assisted living I can bet there are more that are miserable and not happy at all.
"I'd be interested in a crystal ball to check up on the future of all the people who spout this callus nonsense to see whether that attitude is just for thee and not me"
I have no interest in extending my life in anyway, shape or form if I am incontinent and require people to wipe my ass and bathe me. If I have cancer I won't get treatment, Same with dialysis or a pacemaker or any of it.
The elderly are a drain on our resources when they get to this point. It is ridiculous to give a 90 plus year old cancer treatment, or a heart bypass, or dialysis, etc. Especially and even more true if they have dementia.
The only people that benefit from propping up old people in this condition are the owners of said nursing homes, and hospitals. Corporations will bleed the system dry as long as possible.
And considering most of the posts here are about elderly family members (I hate to use the word loved ones in this regard) who are abusers (child and current), narcissists and generally unpleasant, nasty, selfish, people the only conclusion that I can make is that the sooner these people die the better off their family members will be and society in general. These types are lucky that people couldn't pick and choose who dies (the way they do in shelters with animals) because most would have been sent to the euthanasia room a long time ago.
I am currently reading Kate Christie's short book on VSED self-deliverance. Recommended to those with any interest in the subject.
My own brother so wished he could "go" when he was diagnosed with probable early Lewy's Dementia. And we did have honest "discussions". I mean we discussed the barbeque in the bathroom method. We discussed it ALL! He chose not to; chose to see it out, not knowing what it would bring if I promised to be there to help him.
He was a man very much into control, and the fear of loss of control was worse than anything he could imagine. As it turned out he did get sepsis from a surface cut on his shin, and he DID go, just a year and one half after diagnosis with Lewy's. And he was HAPPY about that. And though I miss this man more than I could ever say, I was happy for him. I am so thankful he didn't have to go the long slow trail.
Death is a part of life. I can tell you as an RN that many, many patients told me they wanted to go, were ready to go, and couldn't talk with their families about that. They were in daily pain, and feared the long slow slide into helplessness. My own dad told me he had had a wonderful life, but was exhausted with it. Many recognize that the quality of life they wished to live is done. That it is now for them a waiting game. And likely AS MANY don't feel that way and would love to go on forever.
I think we see people, more than the normal share, likely, on AC who are suffering "life's continuing", and often not very happily.
I wouldn't wish covid on them, or any other illness.
I am simply saying here that some of us are ready to go. Would volunteer. And I felt that a long time. So long in fact that when Sarah Palin was out there threatening us with "death panels" I was giggling and saying "Oh, please, please, do I get to raise my hand and volunteer".
I have always had an "interest" in death. Never seen it as a threat (tho I see suffering as one and always did). Should have been a Hospice nurse when Hospice was the "godsend" it started as.
Covid? I don't know. It's my personal choice to stay protected, or certainly somewhat protected. But I have no problem with those who choose not to, as long as they understand the risks to themselves from, say, long covid. And I definitely believe in protecting the helpless. HOWEVER, I could not be with my dying brother. He died at the beginning of covid when they locked us DOWN and AWAY from one another real tight for just a bit. Pretty tough. Couldn't actually even fly to him in his last illness. I would hate to see the return when our elders, already suffering, are locked behind windows away from us, unprotected in a facility where many serving are already ill and exhausted. It was a time honestly hard to remember already, for me.
I agree with SP in that I think there are MANY things much worse than death.
But I agree with you that it is demanded of us that we protect the vulnerable to the best of our ability.
None of this is as black and white as we wish life to be. No easy answers. And what I love so much about AC is the VARIETY of the input. It's quite fascinating. And helpful. And thought-provoking.
I had my 2 shots and a booster. I am done. My DH and I are basically homebodies. I rarely shop unless I have to. I believe we can be careful. I still give 6 ft when in line. I try not to shake hands. Haven't found a nice way to say "sorry I don't shake hands". I am not a hand shaker anyway so was glad when I didn't need to do it during COVID.
My BIL has a PHD in immunology and says masks do not work. (He did get his shots and 2 boosters.) I carry one with me in case I am asked to wear it. I don't argue. It will be a while before we know what the ramifications will be in reference to the shots. Its what it is.
I know this is going to sound terrible but most people in the nursing home are there because it's there last stop to their final exit.
Many are incontinent, have multiple end of life health issues.
Many are miserable and want to die every single day.
Many are in physical and mental anguish.
Many if not all are not going to get any better than they are right now, today and will in fact get worse.
What exactly are we protecting them from here, an earlier more peaceful end?
I don't get it.
I agree. When my FIL’s AL had an outbreak of a gastro virus , there were signs on doors . And they have always done that for gastro virus outbreaks even pre Covid as well . My daughter worked at this same AL 10 years ago when she was in high school serving dinner and there were signs . Why is it taboo to put a sign on the door for FLU, Covid and other outbreaks to give the visitors a heads up ? It’s ridiculous . I also agree that we should be protecting the residents and try not to bring in disease to the building .
DH was annoyed that he was not called by the facility to tell him his Dad is on quarantine in his room . DH and I think it’s wrong to not have a sign on the door for visitors giving them a heads up that there is Covid in the building, so the visitor could decide if they want to visit or postpone . And even if the visitor enters the building they won’t know if the person they are visiting has it or is on quarantine because there are no signs on the doors to a residents’ room . Previously they would have an isolation sign . It’s not fair to have visitors walking in blind . A heads up should be given .
Epidemics, pandemics and other contagious diseases are scary. I was born at the end of the polio epidemic. The almost religious fervor of the drive to vaccinate children is really quite something to read about. As is the selflessness of the researchers who developed the vaccines. So different from what obtains today.
In the same way that the 1918 'Flu epidemic left us with yearly vaccines, so will COVID. I still wear a mask in the subway, in theaters and in large gatherings. I don't wear a mask at my place of worship (unless I'm leaving on a trip the next week) because it's a risk I'm willing to take.
Germs have no politics. They are opportunistic.
For me I am up to date on Vacc and I am masked in public on transit, in stores. I decided I quite like not even having a case of the sniffles for the last four years. However, I don't demand that the family coming and going mask up, or take a test, and don't mask up when they come over, so I AM more at risk.
While it isn't gone, and likely won't be--will become just another virus--it is much much weakened. My doctor did tell me she is seeing things that make her question cardiovascular events and CVAs in patients with "long covid" as well as embolisms and other clotting things that are so far "of interest" but without proof as to causation.
So on we go. I think now an individual choice as to how we behave, but appreciate your input and no one sure has to tell ME to mask up. As I said, I quite like no colds, let alone Covid. Don't worry about survival now, do worry about long covid.
What I think you meant was so much for being vaxxed and boosted and unafraid.
If this doesn't convince you that the vaccination is worthless I don't know what will. I think it all comes down to a persons immune system and other underlying diseases they have that can cause death from COVID or a more serious case of COVID. That an how often a person washes their hands. Many people really don't wash their hands enough and hand sanitizer doesn't cut it. Because we have seen that vaxxed or unvaxxed your odds are pretty much the same with getting it or not getting it.
And I would avoid said friends house for Thanksgiving if I were you.
I hope both of your friends are on a good probiotic. That needs to be taken two hours before or after any antibiotic they are taking.
My neighbor (in his late 30s with Crohn's disease) did and still does the whole mask, vax, boosting thing. This past week they were on a flight returning home (not sure if domestic or not) and all 3 in his family got covid.
I'm not an antivaxxer but really, what is the point if it doesn't really protect you...?
Maybe AI will someday be able to sort through all the data and figure out what-the-heck went on with covid and the vaccines.
My DH, who's had a liver transplant, has been to several concerts over the summer, along with his good friend who's very sick with lymphoma. Life goes on, covid or no covid.
As far as "vaccinations" go, they don't work either and the Mayo Clinic told the transplant patients to STOP getting "boosters" from last fall on. They tend to cause more issues than contracting the virus, as I can attest to myself.
Living in fear of this virus is wasting our lives. I hope your friends have a speedy recovery.