I've posted before about in-law care-giving. Aged mother in law, lives in same town.
We are at the tail end of a visit from sister in law from several states away. Sister in law has been here for 3 weeks caring for her mother. A much welcome respite.
It had been discussed, prior to her arrival here on the scene, she would be talking it over with her mother, to try and get her mom to come up to her home, for a stay of maybe a few months.
This, in my opinion, is absolutely essential, as I am expecting twin grand-children, due in about 1 month (if they don't come sooner, as is the case a lot of times with multiples pregnancies). The expectant mother also lives locally here, and has a 4 year old daughter. I will be on that front, helping .. as much as is needed. And not on the front with mother in law and care-giving, and have made that as obvious and apparent as I know how to make it. It would be great if mother in law would agree to go to her daughter's home (several states away) for a period of a few months .. and allow me the latitude to put my energies where I want them to be, on my daughter who will have had a c-section .. and my grand-daughter (4 years old) and new twin babies.
Nothing doing. Mother in law has dug in her heels, and will not hear of it, going to stay with her daughter for any period of time.
What are her reasons?
In mother in law's defense ... her daughter ... I don't even know how to describe it. I will say that when her daughter comes here to visit, she all but breathes for her mother and if she could find a way to do that, she'd do that too. She is the most nervous nelly, never sit down - ever ... worry wart, do everything, all the time .. person that I've ever encountered.
A great example, as I was taking her to the airport yesterday for her departure, . I reached into the fridge to grab myself a bottled water and shut the fridge and turned to walk away, as I've done for all of my 50 plus years living on this earth .. and she said to me, "Oh make sure that fridge shut". WTH???? Like I don't know how to shut a fridge? That's just a small, very small slice of what she is ... how she is.
She is so very hyper-vigilant, seeing to every minute details down to it's finest most minuscule point, fine tooth comb, questioning every point along the way, "should we do thus and so, but maybe if we do thus and so, then such and such will happen, maybe we should do it thus and so .. but then so and so might happen, maybe we shouldn't do thus and so, but do "x" "y" and "z" instead, but if we don't do it that way then ..........", on and on and on and on it goes. And usually in hyper warp speed, as to every single friggin thing.
If her mother moans .. "what's wrong mother?, why did you moan, are you alright?".
Mother: "Yes, I'm fine, I was just sighing out loud".
Sister: "Why did you sigh? Are you hurting, are you sure you're alright, why are you sighing what's the matter?"
Mother: "For God's sake __________________, I was just sighing, .. calm down, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, .. because if something is wrong you need to tell me".
Mother: "Everything is fine, I'm fine".
Sister: "Are you sure, we did a lot yesterday, did we do too much, maybe we shouldn't of gone to two doctors in one day .. was that too much for you, are you too tired now, maybe we need to move those other doctor appointments so we won't have two in one day, is that too much for you, for one day .. is that why you were sighing .. what's wrong, are you sure you're alright".
Hopefully that kinda gives a little bit of a snapshot of what goes on when sister is in the ring directing things.
So in mother in law's defense.. I do get it, why she wouldn't be chomping at the bit to go to her daughter's home.
BUT ....
The only experience she has with her daughter, in the last years as mother in law has aged and been unable to go anywhere much, has been the daughter coming here, periodically, for periods of about 3 weeks at a stretch. When her daughter comes here, she moves heaven and earth for her mother and then some, and doesn't sit down, doesn't stop .. the WHOLE ENTIRE TIME.
Is there a possibility maybe (as I said to mother in law, when she expressed that isn't happening - talking to me - her going to her daughters .. ever) .. could it be possible that maybe if you would go to where she lives .. she'd be more busy managing her own life in that setting than your's and she would get out of your backside .. and not be as hyper-drive-vigilant as you experience in her, when she's here, could that be possible.
The daughter is retired, lives several states away. Does come here, generally, every few months .. and stays for a period of about 3 weeks at a stretch. I wish I could make a list of everything the daughter did when here this last time, but it would take up the whole character allotment:
Initially, I thought it was a bunch of quivering lipped, weakling, sissy nonsense. After all, I had a crap childhood, was pretty much left to raise myself and I turned out all right. Didn’t I?
Or did I?
In the wisdom of my ripe old age, I’ve come to believe that there is much more to the Inner Child business than I had first given credit. So, in hanging out my closet psychiatrist shingle I’ve been thinking about your Inner Child, Dorker.
A week or so ago, Dorker - you made a lengthy post stating all the reasons that you have been - and were continuing to be - comfortable and accepting in sitting in your place on the periphery of your fathers and stepmothers life.
Yet, a couple of days ago you talked of your hurt at being rejected by K in lieu of her choosing “C” to sort through a few of the details of K’s and your fathers rapidly sinking ship. As well, until giving it further thought - initially, you were ready to wrestle the single visitors chair out from under K, in order to be present during your fathers heart procedure.
Honestly? I can’t say as I blame you on either account. I believe you are/were right. Intentional or not - K slapped you in the face - again. Another in a long list of rejection and devaluation. And, for sure - if the doctors needed to impart any information and/or further instructions regarding your fathers condition and care - you are the better choice in hopes the information would be retained and acted upon. However...
Often times in family dynamics the right choice - the better choice - is not the path that is followed. Even in the best of families- let alone dysfunctional ones further complicated by dementia, steps and prior history.
But - the Inner Child can be a persuasive task master. Often silent but driven nonetheless. In spite of declarations to the contrary - I suspect your Inner Child is still looking for acceptance from K and still hoping for your father to FINALLY put his children first. I don’t blame you one bit or believe you to be wrong - in these hopes.
But, I do think these Inner Child longings are in vain and that in the long run you may be setting yourself up for more hurt and more disappointment.
Expecting K to recognize that she is slipping mentally is never going to happen. It was NEVER going to happen. Expecting your father to nut-up and change his well worn path of least resistance? Not likely - not unless it suits his best interest AND he has you as his gate-keeper and protector.
Do with this - my opinion - what you will. Say I’m full of chit and move on. Or - give it some thought, exam your motivation and expectations. Adjust YOUR path - if need be.
I will leave you with a movie quote. All of the answers to life’s questions can be found in the movies... says my Inner Child.
It’s from A River Runs Through It. A beautifully filmed but sadly underrated movie:
”But if boyhood questions aren't answered before a certain point, they can't be raised again. So we returned to being gracious to one another...”. ~ Norman Maclean;
A River Runs Through It
Linda is so right. Dorker, it sounds like you are going to agree to be POA.
*Are you sure you are prepared for all this might entail?*
Why not let the eldercare attorney become the POA?
Someone else mentioned something about your father making you be the one to deal with K. And that is a very good point. Your father must have realized he could have died when K couldn't get him up from the floor. He has now realized that K cannot take care of him. We know he wants to live, as he wants all measures taken to sustain his life and won't sign a DNR order.
So now he thinks he can put you in charge, shut K out, and leave you to deal with her.
Are you really okay with this? Just because he summons you or asks you or expects you to do something, does not mean that you have to do his bidding.
You can still be an emotionally supportive daughter without doing all of the rest of it.
As doc with no bedside manner at'all said .. when asked by me, .. "hmm .. I thought that we might find some problems there .. the shortness of breath, the low BP .. no?".
His answer: "Not in his heart, no .. his heart is not an issue".
Me: "No blockages?".
Him: "Well, . everybody his age is gonna have some . but his are at 50% or less, we don't do stents until it's 70% or more, his heart is fine .. whatever chest pain and shortness of breath . . and low BP he is experiencing .. is not heart related".
And with that, he was gone .. busy busy guy I suppose.
Glad that's behind us . .left a mssg for Pulmonary and Hospitalist to call me . but did that yesterday also and got no return phone call from either.
And talked to the atty that specializes in DPOA . and the process they utilize .. if the setting where dad is .. hospital or otherwise, allows visitors . .some don't he tells me .. (I happen to know the hospital he is in does, 1 visitor . as will be the case when he arrives at the Rehab site, . whenever that is, they allow 1 visitor also) .. then they can do it.
Their process . they wanna talk to him on the phone first .. and that is set for 2 PM this Friday tentatively .. and that is to ascertain if he is of sound mind . and capable of making sound/rational decisions as to whom he wishes to name as DPOA .. and once that's achieved, . they'll get all the paperwork done as to designates . and addresses and so forth . proceed to whatever setting . and visit in person . and atty leaves the room .. and notary comes in . and grab a hospital . I dunno . who ..??.. janitor .. dietary .. I dunno . they just need a witness .. and grab someone to witness the signing ... as the notary does their thing . and it's done.
Doesn't have to be filed with the state/courts, .. etc. It's done . .once it's formalized in their offices, . the docs can be emailed out and that's that.
If you can't have dad execute a POA at all, then you either get an emergency guardianship, which allows you to directly talk to the bank, insurance, and creditors, or you give it over to the state. I'm sure the social worker will be willing to discuss emergency guardianship with you. Please call her so you are not flying blind.
After you discuss emergency guardianship, then you can look at it and say, "it's not worth it." Then you can be just a nice person who really can't help at all, but can provide emotional support. That's where you wanted to be a year ago, and that's a fine place now. 💗
Almost as an anchor to her floating into an abyss of a lost mind .. he and his situation is the tether to her .. floating into oblivion in a lost mind .. it's her purpose for the air she breathes ..
Any intrusion into that bubble is seen by her as just that, an intrusion . that's her charge, her responsibility ..
So . the status quo is that she .. very well could be the one already there .. I wasn't gonna get up at the butt crack of dawn and park my behind there, from dark-thirty in the AM . and onward . to prevent . her being that 1 lone guest allowed. She may very well be there .. (doubt it) .. when I get there, and I'll have no choice, but to turn and walk back thru that massive complex and into the parking garage to my car, and leave . and the person there as reporter to the goings on . his wife . she with scrambled eggs for brains ..
I can't change that.
I've questioned myself .. too .. what could they have done with a person who stands dug in firmly in refusal to admit there is an issue with her brain . what could they have done . to make it such that .. she isn't the one considered to be (spouse) and of sound mind and ability .. what could they have done differently ..
I don't know . I don't know what one does with a spouse or LO that absolutely digs in and firmly refuses to address/admit that their brain is slipping . .. I don't know.
Yes, . talk to the doc behind her back . but she can showtime . for the 10/15 mins the doc spends with her, . unless her doc is very very conscientious .. and takes it a further step in asking her to submit to some cognitive testing . which she could refuse to do ..
What could they have done ... ??...I don't know.
So .. here we have it, . her with half a brain left, .. but can't tell her that . she thinks she's fine .. and so... because she fixates on dad, . because she is so very territorial and proprietary and so .. oh I dunno .. doesn't want any intrusion ... it's a mess, .. a huge/enormous mess.
I know for a fact, my dad .. is a bit bewildered at having to undergo the heart cath .. and .. a bit apprehensive . and I also know if they were to come into his room, "Gee, Mr. B we have an issue here, seems your wife is here .. as is your daughter, . you're gonna have to pick one .. we can't have two guests" .. I know who he'd pick . hands down .. I have the brain matter to sort thru important detail if any given .. not her . he'd choose me as that attendee . .and send her packing .. be damed the consequences ...
Sad as that is .. I know that would be the case, hands down.
But .. I don't think they care one way or the other, staff . you can have one guest, you guys sort it out. I'm not gonna create any scene . and cause her to get upset .. and cause a scene .. that's what he'll be left with . if in fact, she's there on site ...
I didn't make the mess here, I can't fix it. I can only try to support where I can . where she steps in .. and rightfully so as the spouse (compromised as she is) .. I have to stand down . and will do so . as I've done with the whole ckbook fiasco . hasn't been mentioned again . .and won't be.
Last I heard, . she was either going to
A) Go there herself, . ckbook in hand . .and whatever other papers and the two of them work thru it, hasn't happened
or
B) Have C (stepsister's DH) look thru it .. and help sort and straighten it out.
I did what I was asked to do, .. try to go there .. and that failed, .. massive fail . and so .. I've let it go. I'm not asking for the ckbook and navigating some way to get signed cks . and dispense with billing matters.
I can't fight city hall . don't care to. She obviously does not want my intrusion . and so be it. She's gonna make sure that I am stiff armed in any attempts to help . .as has been the case, when I get summoned by dad . to go assist in some way . and her .. yes, sweet as pie .. and ... tactful and so forth, but pushing back on .. "why your dad calls you .. I don't know, I'm sitting here with nothing to do . but take care of him ... but he bothers you . he shouldn't bother you, I can take care of that" (whatever *that* is).
Obviously she can't . or it would've been done .. and seen to .. thus he wouldn't of called me .. but I guess that's beside the point.
So be it.
My presence, .. assistance, is perceived as an intrusion by her. I guess that works, somewhat, .. when dad is present in the HH there and has summoned me to help ... the two of them fighting and bickering .. a hostile/combative setting . and her pushing back that I shouldn't of even been called. At present, dad is not in the HH . and so . she can push back . and keep me stiff armed. So be it.
As to what I'll do when I leave here in a bit to head to the hospital and find that she's already the 1 guest that is allowed (I don't think that'll be the case .. she hasn't yet tried to go there .. dad having diverted her .. even though I clearly told her, much to her surprise . that 1 guest is allowed now . he diverted that in talking to her, . telling her "the whole Covid thing, they aren't gonna let you in"). Seemingly she bought that .. I guess, and hasn't tried to go there, .. if she has . and got lost trying to do so . I wouldn't know it ..
I don't think I'll find her there, the one guest allowed. But if I do, no .. I will have to depart .. and not be there, she's his spouse .. I have no legal standing . and so be that too. I can't change the course of the universe.
Unfortunate in that her brains are scrambled eggs most of the time and any reporting of facts as to a heart cath . and what's done or to be done, etc .. will be a jumbled up not retained mess in her brain . and it would be better, if I were present.
But that's his spouse .. such that it is .. and so .. I will have to defer .. and I know that.
It's all such a jumbled up mess. I ponder what must life be like for those who have aging parents, .. perhaps one of them with a jumbled brain matter, .. but perhaps a sweet disposition and welcoming of help . and maybe some awareness of the jumbled mess their brain is . and willing/able/compliant with any/all help anyone can offer. What must that be like. Not the case here.
I ponder . were it that setting where the jumbled up brain individual . were a sweet disposition . and not so territorial and fixated . and proprietary .. maybe she'd be welcoming . ."Oh Dorker, you know my brain is not what it used to be . thank you so much for being there, . you know I wouldn't' be able to keep it straight what's said to me".
That isn't the case, in any fraction of any sense, not with this situation.
That coupled with the fact, no one . not her daughter, not her sisters . not my dad .. has been able to get her to budge one inch on the fact that her brain isn't working right, let's go get this looked at. Not one inch . she has stood firm in refusal to do so . and all the while holding guard gate to her fixation on dad
Come on; you keep telling us that the woman has scrambled eggs for brains; you can't get her to let you into YOUR FATHER'S HOUSE to get items he's requested and in the past, he's had to sneak them to you.
He's AFRAID of her. He's afraid of her craziness, her volatility and the exhaustion and embarrassment she causes him.
That stunt with not getting him help when he couldn't get up at home nearly killed him. If you hadn't stepped in and call 911, overnight with untreated sepsis...
Dorker, this situation is beyond what mere mortals, even super-Dorker mortals can deal with. Becoming your father's financial Power of Attorney is NOT what you want to have happen.
The eldercare attorney needs to bring in his social worker and an intervention has to happen to get K the care she needs. Eldercare attorney needs to be dad's POA and guardianship pursued for K if she won't grant anyone POA or is deemed too far gone to do so.
Unless BOTH problems get solved simultaneously, there is NO solution.
Doesn't the Surgeon give a short "went well" call to the next of kin/HCPOA? Or maybe not where you live.
Would it be unreasonable to just have your phone on for news & visit next when he likely to be awake?
Midkid58: "This may not be 'legal' but it IS sensible: have dad sign several blanks checks for next months bills. Then they're ready to go."
I did this with my mother, and it worked until the bank was doing a random check and questioned why the writing on the check was different from the signature. They apparently called my mother, and of course no one answered as she was in rehab. So the check was not accepted, there was some kind of returned check fee, and the city (this was a property tax payment) didn't allow a personal check to pay any city bill for a year afterwards. So be careful (even though it usually works!)
If your father is in no condition to sign checks, you would probably have a very hard time getting K to sign any checks for you.
Really, getting the eldercare attorney to get a POA that names him is the best course of action.
contradicting what he'd said . that in fact, one can go visit him now. Sounds like she bought it, .. that one can't visit now .. with the whole Covid thing and stayed away ..
Hasn't landed there, ready to camp out and stay the duration around the clock .. (not yet, but that could change).
Dad: "Her overwhelming priority in talking to me, was concern for how sick I've been .. and worry about that, that seemed to be foremost in her thought process as I talked to her on the phone .. ".
Me: "And you and I both know, . she could show up at your door at any moment and her first and only thought process at that moment, the repetition of when are you coming home . .she can take care of you .. and on and on that could go".
Dad: "Oh very much so, very volatile .. ".
She hasn't seen fit (not yet) to tottle her way to the hospital . .and set up shop there to stay .. and bringing w/her financial matters that he has expressed a want to resolve.
We will see what tomorrow holds. Dad has agreed/relented, finally to that heart cath procedure .. and that is to occur tomorrow AM .. time unknown .. just "morning" is all they've said.
I will be trying to be on site .. as he's awfully weak and compromised, . and the concern . things happen . blood clots .. etc .. and now you have a heart attack or a stroke .. just . thing can happen.
One is only allowed 1 visitor . and I intend to be that one visitor.
Interesting in that, one should always defer to the spouse IMO .. and should she show up . .normally that would dictate that I dispense with my presence there and defer to her as the spouse.
But you see, .. she of scrambled eggs for brains . and the doc comes back with any news, .. as to the heart cath and what was done, or will need to be done, etc .. she isn't a reliable source for that info .. she won't... can't process it all. So .. I intend to be that one visitor ..
Have no idea if she intends to be there. My dad said that he intends to inform her . and I encouraged he do that, .. I haven't reached out to inform her of said procedure .. he said he'd do so . good enuf for me, do it then . or don't.
It's a really odd situation. On the one hand . if I were her, I'd be mad as a hornet that he has .. essentially shut himself and any news about himself, .. off from her. And maybe she is ... mad as a hornet about it .. justifiably so. I'd be mad too.
But on the other hand .. I get it . why he builds a brick wall and hides behind it w/regard to her. She is incessant in her broken brain. She is actually .. so it seems anyway . doing a lot better staying by herself . than I'd of predicted (but I don't know . I'm not on site .. to see if she's caught the kitchen on fire, or wrecked the car, .. or whatever else may have befallen her and her staying alone these days). Maybe the stress of c'giving my dad .. and that now absent her periphery . is finding her better able to manage than any of us might've predicted, who knows.
But I do get it why he hides behind a brick wall w/regard to her. I've seen it myself. The Oxy being one issue that she has been relentless about. I have ck'd with med staff, more than once, and it's said to be not anything they are seeing as problematic .. and so . her harping on that and fixating on it as an issue, . just one that she harps on . and stays stuck on .. relentless with it.
She was .. before he went "confidential" . .calling him every 10 mins .. ."when are you coming home, why aren't you coming home, you know I can take care of you here . you don't need to stay there, . .why won't you come home".
Him sick as can be . and trying to field that, every 10 mins ... having answered it repeatedly only to have her call again and again, same repetition of the same questions . .forgetting they'd already been asked and answered to the best of his ability.
I don't know who can withstand that, .. I couldn't . and I'm not sick.
So I get it.
I guess thinking I'd take that bait, . . "yea you're right ... you're so smart, .. you're so right . let's just let him sit and spin on those things .. and not worry with it".
I didn't. I responded, . ."oh he's been pretty sick alright .. in fact, really haven't been able to talk to him much ... and for several days . .too sick to talk .. but he is beginning to be able to talk a bit . and still weak, .. still out of breath when he talks a lot .. but . .he has expressed that there are a few things he'd like to attend to, so it's not a problem, I can just come grab them at your house .. and make sure they're attended to for him".
That met in her a response of: "Oh I really don't think he needs to be worrying with all that .. he's far too sick".
To my responding: "I think he can manage at this point, with the few things he has on his mind .. in fact, he noted that you are a signor on the acct, and if I can find the things he has in mind .. and have you sign the checks while there, all the better".
That met a response from her: "Oh well C has agreed (stepsister's husband) to come this way .. I haven't seen them in about a week . .. don't know where they are, but he is to be coming and helping to sort thru some of the bills and I'll just have him look at it, what was it your dad was concerned with, I'll be sure and have C look at it when he comes this way, I hate it that your dad bothered you with all this . you are far too busy for all that, I'll just have C look at it when he comes".
To my responding: "Oh .. C lives all the way in T Town .. about 4 hours away .. it's not a problem ... I'll just scoot by for the couple of things he had in mind .. it's no big deal, .. certainly closer for me to do it than it is for C to travel all this way".
<<<Had already covered the ground, much to her surprise . that visitors .. 1 visitor is now allowable there .. at the hospital .. she was shocked to learn this>>>
Her now responding: "Well now that I know they can have visitors I'll just grab the couple of things and he and I will sort thru it when I go visit him .. he and I can do it, you don't need to worry with it".
At that I dropped it. Fine by me.
I tried to help .. .as per what my dad had on his mind . but I'd tried every angle and she wasn't having it, so I dropped it.
Fine .. go .. as Barb puts it, tottle your way to the hospital and sit down and do so . (though I do know that's the last person on God's green earth that dad wants to see darken his doorway at this point) . but fine by me. (excepting for the fact, .. she may very well get lost and be the next Silver Alert on the news .. trying to do so ... but again, not my problem)
I dropped it.
I did call and alert stepsister that her mom may be next on the Silver Alerts going out .. and it took an inordinate amount of time to reach stepsister ..
When I did, she'd already spoken to her mom ... who .. I guess alerted her that Dorker had been looking to come by . and gather some things in the way of bills/matters financial .. and that she will just have C look at them when he comes.
Asked stepsister, .. "so she isn't out the door on her way to see dad?".
Stepsister: "No . she didn't say she was doing that only that she'd have C look at the bills when he comes".
Stepsister then putting me on the phone with C, to clarify to him what is in question that dad wants looked at, and I did so.
In talking with dad today on the phone . and apprising him of yesterday's happenings w/regard to the above .. and he said that stepmom did call there, and he was able to keep her at bay .. sounds like, .. saying to her something akin to, *well that whole Covid thing you really shouldn't come here ... they won't let you in* (even though I'd already told her contradictory info
They can go over them together and dad can then figure out next steps.
I wouldn't show up until you've got the eldercare attorney in tow and let HIM become POA.
You are back to dealing with difficult, sick, angry and demented old folks who want you to do what you always do: step in and fix it all.
I thought your dad was adamant that K not know where he was? Did he change his mind or were you simply unable to sustain the 'fib'? He is not going to be happy to see his wife, and now the NH or hospital will have her hanging around as much as she can, throwing wrenches in the works.
I'm sorry if I am coming off 'hot' but I so wanted you to be able to extend that calm weekend into a longer period of time. You so needed it---
Since K now knows where her hubby is, she can haul the pertinent documents to him. You don't have the legal 'rights' to do much of anything for him. Right now is a rotten time for him to be trying to get his affairs in order. I know how frustrating this is--I forced my FIL to go with my DH to get an attorney to organize his trust just a few months before he died. Both were/are fabulous procrastinators.
You CAN take the cc bill and the checkbook to dad at the NH and have him pay whatever bills he needs to, and, then you'd have to take the checkbook back b/c he probably shouldn't have that floating around.
This may not be 'legal' but it IS sensible: have dad sign several blanks checks for next months bills. Then they're ready to go.
Your dad sounds like a real pill---manipulative and cranky. I'm sure sorry he's back in your life so much now.
And as far as MIL---I bet we see SIL pretty soon, right? Sounds like she's not doing well at all. I hope you can continue to stay at arm's length and let Dh do his job.
Not mad at you, just feeling sad for you, as it's like it's just one huge drama after another.
GOOD point! Even while waving a POA in front of K, why do you even want to expose yourself to her at all? You know she's difficult. And, as far as chiding SS for not taking care of her mother? Well, K won't give up the control to anyone. So why should SS expose herself any further to her mother? As long as K hasn't been declared incompetent (even though, admittedly, she should be), SS can't make her mother do or not do anything. So SS might as well live her life.
What is so awful about the state taking over your father's financial affairs? You'd still be his HCPOA. But why doesn't he "deserve" what would be the natural result of his refusal to deal with these things when he was repeatedly asked to do so?
Dad had months or years of advance warning that a healthcare crisis might happen to him. He knew K wasn't safe living alone and should have had a plan ready for her care just in case.
You have been so kind to him already Dorker. If you decide not to help them anymore I think that's completely justifiable. Paying bills and stuff mostly helps K, and her daughter SS and husband seem willing to become involved with that.
some of that static coming at me . and I can . with that legal document in hand, .. and my insistence it be airtight . not some flimsy document I was stupid enough to think valid by pulling off the internet .. I can do an end-around where needed and not have to deal with her, .. at least on matters that are solely his and he wishes my attention to.
Does he deserve the service of someone attentive to his matters . that someone being me .. who was sidelined in his life and he in mine. Probably not.
But does he deserve abandonment on my part, . as I turn and walk away from it all, . no I don't think so . thus my decision to be DPOA .. and get that ball rolling.
At this juncture, he only agreed for me (I took the stance, I won't pull a flimsy form off the internet and call it valid, I want it seen to via legal channels) ... and so the the juncture at this point is for me to reach out to the elder attys we dealt with for MIL's matters and get a feel from them .. cost/speed at which this can occur/can it occur, with him hospitalized and Covid restrictions . what with the hospital's stance of only 1 visitor . and the fact a DPOA has to be witnessed/notarized, etc etc .. how does that even occur in the restrictions that are impediments to it all.
So I'll put in a call to the atty office, and get a feel for what's entailed . and we'll go from there.
What I'm not willing to do is stand on any form pulled off the internet and call it valid .. just not willing to go that route.
As to MIL .. and her plight .. seems to be the same .. haven't talked to her, need to .. but one never knows in phoning there . will you get the MIL that is completely out of it . and unable to interact at all, or the one that is a little more lucid (term used loosely .. little more).
OD .. absent OD who has .. for all practical purposes .. turned from the whole MIL scene . .and not visited, not called ... this all born in OD's own precarious mental state . and the fact visits with MIL were proving to be too troubling for her own mental state . .as MIL waxed and waned on about wanting to die .. and so forth . more than OD's mental state could deal with and so she chose to not partake of being a part of MIL's life ...
She has called her this morning, .. prompted by me . who did talk to her and explain we may very well be nearing the end of her ability to .. at least recognize and interact .. if not the end period . of her days on this planet .. and that did prompt OD to call her .. who reports in this AM that she did so . and found MIL .. maybe somewhat coherent .. and the whole .. sad plight of "I've been abandoned here, .. I've been dumped here" the order of the dialogue. Just encouraged OD to divert/redirect, where possible . and .. realize .. as best she can .. that MIL is not right anymore mentally. She said she does realize it. Whether she will now disappear . OD . into oblivion and not further contact MIL is on her, .. I just wanted it known . that any ability to communicate with MIL may be nearing it's end . do with that what you will .. if you wish.
Not pushing her any further.
I didn't tell K that there is this issue hanging as to whether or not a heart cath will proceed, .. why bother . she likely won't remember anyway, what's said.
Could I have fibbed, .. and a "Oh no .. no visitors allowed" .. even tho I know that's not true. Yea, I could've .... I could've done that, and knew walking into the lion's den on trying to go by there to pick up things .. that I'd run headlong into that .. and what will you do Dorker, will you fib . or will you come forth with the truth .. that visitors are allowed. I decided .. made a conscious decision to tell the truth about it. Because ... it's not my job to protect her from herself, nor my job to protect my dad from her onslaught .. I can only manage what I'm managing which is to advocate on his behalf with staff at the hospital and field his phone calls .. about his concerns. What she does .. isn't on me . not do I care for it to be.
Is that possibly lining up that she get out and about and in an accident or a silver alert issued when she gets lost roaming the streets .. looking for the hospital he's in ... or .. go set up camp where his hospital room is. Yep. Quite likely w/her.
But on the opposite end of that, .. is me fibbing to her, .. that visitors aren't allowed .. she get wind somehow that indeed they are, .. because "well whaddya know .. the nurse said that Dorker is in there visiting with him .. I just talked to her and she told me that visitors weren't allowed".
Nope . . decided to fall to the side of .. If I'm asked, I'll tell the truth . where the chips fall in it all, not on me.
That's why I kinda conscientiously decided to not fib. I can't believe her daughter has left here there unattended, .. and better yet, somehow she's managing .. so it's said .. no c'taker on site, .. her daughter 3 or 4 hours away. She must be doing better than I'd of envisioned .. or maybe she isn't and nobody cares .. but .. that too not on me.
Kinda put out with the whole thing. I mean .. I am willing to go run by there, get a cc statement that must've come in the mail (absent any ability to log into that same cc acct online and that doesn't seem to be in existence) ... and get his ckbook and simply write out a check, which btw, . he said she is a signor on .. and have her sign it, right in front of her, stick it in the mail . and done with it .. was willing to do that. Not a problem.
But then to run into . what I suspected I'd run into .. a stone wall .. of obfuscation and diversion.
She obviously doesn't have a problem with C .. coming by to "help" out and look thru bills .. and offer assistance .. and why that is . and not the sea rat children spawn of her husband ... I don't know ... she doesn't trust me .. and even worse as to my brother who has .. thru the years .. (history . ancient history) shown himself to be not trustworthy .. but I haven't ever given any indication at all of someone who is reckless and not to be trusted.
Kinda put out with it all.
As to the DPOA .... and consideration of the contention that will most certainly bring to my corner .. yep aware of that. All too aware. Do I want to put myself in those shoes .. does my dad deserve that I'd wear those uncomfortable shoes for him .. he who was a sideline sitter to my existence .... no .. probably not.
Who does he have to advocate on his behalf .. and .. handle biz matters if I decline to do so. Not a soul. So ... appoint a state guardian to see to such matters. That, .. I don't think he deserves.
In the end, . much discussion on it, . with my DH . but also with two really good friends .. and the conclusion I come to .. is one of .... yea likely it will bring some real contention in dealing with stepmom . but .. waving around a legal document that is airtight .. will negate some of
Until then, those bills can fly their little pink backsides over the treetops 🐖.
I have that ready for my family... you are welcome to use it 😉
I am wondering about this, also. I was surprised that you agreed to go get his checkbook and cc bill, just as you did last year. Just what you thought would happen, happened. And now you seem to still be involved (calling up SS's husband to find out LTC info),
You now seem to be allowing yourself to be inserted into the mess of your father's and SM's finances. HCPOA is one thing; POA is another and will involve much more. You will be fighting about every little bill with SM. Is that what you want? If you are POA, then it's not really so easy to just throw up your hands and walk away (which is what you should be doing).
Why are you putting yourself in the line of fire for a father that firmly put you in the sidelines of his life? There will be a lot of stress for you if you do this. You have said for a long time that you will not do this.
Getting the DPOA done would give you the ability to deal with your dad's bank and get copies of his bills from the merchants directly, which would make it easier to get the info on his LTC and health insurance policies and make sure things are paid...the question is how much responsibility in this do you want to take on? It inevitably will involve some further conflict with K should your dad get to the point that he is incapable of making decisions for himself and you as POA have to then do so. I understand your concern and wanting to help out, but is the stress worth it? Only you know the answer, just something to think about.
And it's a struggle for him to string words together to make a coherent sentence, if he ever did pay anything online the chances he'd remember a User ID and p/w . .. pretty nil .. I'll ask him . but I don't hold out a lot of hope that'll prove anything useful".
C: Okay . well ask him if he has a list of his User ID's and p/w's anywhere . maybe if he can tell us that".
Me; "Ok, I'll ask . but whose to say any of it is current . and if it isn't . he wouldn't know .. ".
C: Ok, .. well and just so ya know, at present . because of the whole Covid thing . creditors are granting forgiveness .. especially to long time customers .. and so .. I don't know that we'll get over that way this week anytime . but soon .. and not real worried about paying that cc bill on time".
Me: "Ok, . .well I wasn't able to go in there and elbow my way around and so . whatever . but hey since I've got you on the phone . I know you took home their LTC policies to review the language .. would you upload his and send it to me .. he's talking about going that route, so it'll be kinda important that document be available as to any intake coordinator .. and if you could send that to me".
C: "Oh . sorry . gotta run . looks like K is calling her daughter here, gotta hand her the phone . sorry".
I texted him my email addy asking that he send that LTC Policy .. and never got any response.
Bears mentioning my brother doesn't trust K, . her daughter .. or her daughter's husband at all in any of this . thinks they are all about the $ .... and will do whatever, say whatever .. to protect $ in all this.
I don't know . it's neither here nor there for me .. I don't know that I buy into that .. but it could be . but nonetheless . not a dam thing I can do about it, so I don't let that part bother me.
Bears mention that I did ask of my dad: "Hey . let me ask you .. you asked me to check with stepsister to see if she can help squirrel these things away to get them to me .. she's out of town btw at present . I've already ck'd with her . she's not in town right now, but let me ask you . do you have any reason to mistrust her .. do you think sharing info with her, .. will it get back to K with nefarious intent .. via stepsister".
Dad: "I've never had any reason to think she is up to no good no".
So all in all, . a very taxing situation . and one that's kinda hurtful .. but ya know .. once a redheaded (proverbially) always a redheaded stepchild.
And then the pics . the still shots taken in DH's attempts today to talk to his mom . she looked like someone breathing her last breath on this earth. So drawn . so sunken in eyes, cheek bones .. just so out of it ..
But then DH's sister talked to her later . and she wasn't as bad off .. (it's never real good .. hasn't been . but has gotten worse thru whatever fog it is that has enveloped her) .. it's gotten worse, .. worse than what is normal for her. SIL talked to her .. at some point thereafter and she didn't seem as out of it .. and so she let DH know, . and he called his mom . and indeed .. she was a little more interactive than he'd found her earlier .. a little anyway .. no memory whatsoever of the skype visit a few hours earlier, .. zip for her, doesn't remember it at all, .. visiting with DH and DD on a skype visit.
"I think they've changed it now . one person can visit .. only one"
Stepmom: "THEY DID??!?!?! I didn't know that".
Me: "I think it's new .. I haven't been there, .. ".
Stepmom: "Oh I didn't know that .. well I can go see him then, if they're allowing visitors .. I can go see him . what is it you said he was looking for, .. I can take it to him and he and I will work thru it".
Me; "his ckbook and cc statement".
Stepmom: "Well I don't know right off hand where they'd be, but I will certainly get them and go see him . and he and I will go thru the items".
Me: "I don't know that you need to go there, .. the whole Covid thing . and he's really not up to visitors per se .. but .. ".
Stepmom: "Well now that I know they are allowing a visitor . I can certainly go see him .. you don't need to worry about it, .. I don't think he needs to be either . he sounds too sick to be worrying with bills .. I can take care of it for him .. but if I can't .. I'll take the things with me and have him work thru it".
That means a couple of things .. she's gonna possibly
A) Get in her car and go there, which may result in a silver alert
B) If she gets there successfully . she will set up camp and not leave .. stay there day and night and make a nuisance of herself .. and dad too ill to deal with her
The very things I did not want to have to talk to her, so I could avoid.
I kinda knew it would go the direction it did, and it did.
But I can't just show up at their house and start elbowing my way around to find his cc statement and his ckbook, . sorta have to call first...
So I hung up from that phone call . with just dread. I didn't mind helping out .. especially since I'd already laid the law down with my dad on the DPOA issue . and that had gone successfully ..
And to now gets stonewalled by her, as to trying to help.
Interesting isn't it .. that my "help" is declined, all in the same sentence where it's mentioned that C .. (stepsister's husband) has offered that he'll come sort thru and help with bills and so forth . and so .. I guess .. as it always was .. me and my brother the little sea rats that we are and always were .. still are.
Next called stepsister to try to alert her .. that her mom may be on the news tonight as a silver alert, and what had occurred. Couldn't get her .. tried her cell several times, couldn't get her. Reached out to stepsister's husband .. asking that he have her call me, she did.
By that time she'd spoken with her mother . and her mother's story was that there are some bills that dorker was wanting to come get on B's part (my dad) but that she wrote them down . and C can look at them when he comes.
Me talking to her: "Well, if that's the worst of it . then okay .. I was worried she'd set out for the hospital . she didn't mention doing so to you".
Stepsister: "She can't, they don't allow visitors"
Me: "Yes they do, . only one . that's new news . but yes they do".
Stepsister: "Does she know that?".
Me: "Yes, she asked me and I wasn't going to lie, I told her".
Stepsister: "Oh chit .. I've been telling her they aren't allowing visitors . I didn't think they did".
Me: "It's pretty new, but yes, one visitor".
Stepsister: "Hmm . no she didn't mention trying to set out to go see him .. not to me".
Me: "Okay well she did to me .. so .. do with that what you will".
Stepsister: "I'm 4 hours away from there, if she sets out to go see him and ends up lost there's not a thing I can do about it. And what was it your dad needs .. here talk to C .. I'm gonna put him on the phone . he'd told mother he'd help her sort some bills, hold on let me put him on the phone ".
Share with C (her husband) what it is I was looking for and why . and he asked, . "Can you ask your dad .. is there any other way he's paid his cc bill . I mean most of us do this stuff online . do you think he ever did that .. maybe if there's an account online"
Me: "C .. to be honest with you .. he's so weak
I have been avoiding his wife like the plague . not talking to her, letting her daughter deal with her.
But .. I did reach out to the daughter, "hey are you in town, . need to grab a few of my dad's things".
Her answer: "I'm in T town .. for two weeks, not there".
So .. she has left the vicinity. She is at her other home, about 3 or 4 hours away .. and .. no imminent plans to return here locally. Unbelievable she has left her mom unattended. I did ask her "So your mom is all by herself, . and doing okay?".
Her answer: "She is managing alright, just sad that your dad doesn't call her, .. she misses him".
((I wasn't aware he still hasn't talked to her, . I knew he hadn't when he was in the rehab site . but was sent to the hospital .. and I assumed that situation had changed, guess not . his wife ..and her scrambled brain still left out in the cold.))
I had sent that letter via YD the other day . and I guess now is the first time my dad has even had any inclination at all, to be able to look at it, thus his phone call today. Still very weak . and a struggle for him to string together a sentence, but at least what words come out now .. aren't thru yelling . and it taking every once of energy he has to make his voice box activate. Still hard to understand, but a little better.
So .. he asked that I get his ckbook . and his cc statement and pay those .. I was willing to do that, .. even better if stepsister would be in town and could sneak those items out from under her mom . and let me get them.
I kinda figured it would go the way it did . and it did.
I had to call stepmom .. "Hey I need to run by there in just a bit to grab dad's ckbook and his cc statement, . he needs to get that paid".
Stepmom: "Oh now why would he bother you with that, you're so busy . .I can take care of that, .. ".
Me: "I don't mind it's not a problem".
Stepmom: "Well so you've talked to him .. I haven't even talked to him . how is he doing" (her now beginning to cry .. it is heartbreaking .. I get it .. she's his wife, she's worried about him, . understandable . .and I also get it why he can't deal with her .. she is maddening to deal with and he's far too sick).
Me: "Yes, I didn't . for several days he was too sick . couldn't talk, but he is getting a little stronger, and so yes, I've talked to him".
Stepmom: (her crying now) .. "well I just sit here and cry and pray and pray and cry . that's all I can do, I haven't talked to him at all, and I have worried myself sick".
Me; "Well your prayers are working . he is a little stronger now, at least he can talk some, he wasn't able to do that much before".
Stepmom: "Well I don't think he should be worrying with these bills .. I can take care of that .. and C (stepsister's husband) has said he'd come help .. I haven't seen them in a week or so . he and stepsister .. but . he said he'd come and help . if I need to, I'll let him know what it is your dad is looking for, and maybe he can make heads or tails of it".
Me: "Oh I know what he's looking for, . nothing big to make heads of tails of .. his ckbook and his cc statement . nothing big".
Stepmom; "Oh well I can certainly take care of that, . he shouldn't bother you with that".
Me: "It's not a bother, . ya know C lives over in T Town . may be a while til he can get here .. I don't mind, I'll scoot by and pick it up for him".
Stepmom: "Well can you even see your dad, have you been to see him?"
((((The question I've been avoiding .. like its a diseased contagious germ))))
Me: "I haven't no .. I've been out of town".
Stepmom: "are they still not allowing visitors".
(((The question I don't wanna have to lie about)))
Me: "I think they changed that in the last few days .. I haven't been there, .. I haven't gone to see him . but I think they've changed it now,
Im afraid you’re at the part that
is both hard and harder.
The hard part - just my take on it - is that it sounds like MIL’s cloud has drifted into her air space. It’s hard to witness - watching them fad away like this. But - it can be made a little easier by recognizing that there isn’t a dam thing you can do about it. I suspect the Covid19 lockdown is the cause. Once they get to MILs place - that old, life as they knew it gone and basically spending time in a nursing home with no “goal” or “purpose“ - they live for the visits with their family and it is those visits - and family - that keep them tethered to reality and to life. Once that’s gone? What is there? They get lost in a final fog and walk deeper and deeper into it.
The harder. Things with Dad and SM seem to have a ways to go still - in terms of a bumpy ride and your seat in the car. Whether you remain a passenger in the back seat or take over the driving - and if driving, you’ll need to shift down into second and roll SM out into SS driveway - but either way - buckle up.
This is where we all become Marines... or is it the Army?
“When the going gets tough, the tough get going”. You’ve got this. It sure as hell ain’t gonna be easy but you’ve got this. And, the Xanax.
I've a feeling it's going to be needed. 2020 could well see you & DH lose a parent 😔
What will be will be.