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sosadandmad Asked February 2014

If Mom were to pass, can my siblings come and go as they please?

Prior to my Fathers' passing, he asked me to move in with Mom to help her out and care for her. She's 81 does not drive but mentally sound. (not to nice) but she's my Mom. I gave up everything and my son and i moved in. I have 3 older sisters, two live within 5 minutes of here. It costs me more to live here than it did on my own. It's been a little over 3 years (blood,sweat and tears) I can count on 1 hand how many times they have taken her out or given a ride. They hardly visit and it hurts my Mom. They cherished my Dad me too but not her and she although she can be mean did just as much for us as he did. They say crazy things about when Ma dies, I want my Money, or we're selling the house immediately, just mean stuff that makes me real sad and mad. I do not feel like what my parents worked for is MINE, I even said to her Ma why dont you leave everything to Boys Town or St. Judes 2 of her favorites. Its just sad. My ? is though when and if my mom passes before me, can they come and go as they please (do i have tenant rights?) And don't they have to give me time to find a new place and clean out the house??? Thanks for letting me rant and any help is greatly appreciated. And from what I see on this site, None of us are alone, so keep caring and smiling. (those of us who do it wouldn't have it any other way)

pipruby Feb 2014
Maybe you can consult an elder lawyer and see if there is a way to see that things are divided equally, or you are financially compensated for the care you have provided.

JessieBelle Feb 2014
Hmm... you have been caring for your mother for 3 years without any help. What I would hope is that she would be willing to redo the will and leave the house to you. That would help make your life easier and will give her the chance of contributing something to you for all the help you've been.

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Patathome01 Feb 2014
Advice on driving: do not let your elderly parent drive if they have near accidents like on of my friends did. Do not even ride with them. If the driver gets into an accident and it turns out to be his/her fault, a lawsuit could result in loss of assets, including any property someone may own. I refused to let Mom drive. From 2012 to 2013, I would not let my 92-year old stubbornly independent mom drive her car; around or out of our condo complex, I had to move her car to another visitor space every 72 hours to avoid towing! When I drove the car to a service for an auto inspection, I was told that a $500 repair job on the 1993 car had to be done. Mom then decided to sell the car because she thought she was no going to drive anytime soon!

pamstegma Feb 2014
Pat at home, if you were MY family, of course we would see to your needs. Legally, however, no one is forced to care for you. You would have to go to Social Services to find housing for the disabled. All families are different.

Bonfire Feb 2014
Get an attorney - and a new lock as soon as they pass. All I can say is just, WOW.

Patathome01 Feb 2014
If you have a disability and cannot work, will your family help support your needs during and after your parents' death?

Countrymouse Feb 2014
Oh dear, KP, I was afraid someone would know personally of that's having happened. Sigh :(

KathleenPlano Feb 2014
I have read the question & responses. Strictly regarding the house & estate there are too many things unknown. If you were to get a lawyer to protect that you could stay in the house til it sells I don't know how it would be written because what if something happens between now & her death that means the house is used to pay either medicaid back or creditors back like for healthcare expenses not thought of now. If they try to write down that you have time to move out and the house ends up not belonging to the estate that would seem an impossible legal stipulation. At least I have never heard of it.

As for siblings not forcing out a caregiver sibling on the day of death it happened to my cousin. All the siblings flew in for the funeral hired authorities & the eldest sister was on the curb a few days after the funeral so the siblings could return to their jobs & locations. This was a family that got along well & each child had shared the caregiving to a certain extent. One had her for a couple years, only the one made executor never had to do any caregiving. Luckily for the one evicted she had been allowed vacations away infrequently by the executor (brother) and had met a man on a cruise she married when evicted. They had been dating & he had been good to the mother as well. So fortunately she had a place to go. This was all done quickly so they could list the house to sell it & break it up or pay debts. This was years ago & the house is still not sold.

So yes they will put you out if they have a mind to.Hopefully you can become the heir of the house at least so instead of a time limit to move out you can have a place to reside permanently. It isn't about having a right to what she earned, it is also about having a way to live when you are no longer able to work since you are giving up your time now when you could be working. At least that is how I see it.
At the very least a lawyer should be able to protect the house for you & it seems that it should happen asap since there is a 5 year lookback from nursing home medicaid in case that becomes a given later.

Stressed52 Feb 2014
Money may be tight for you, I don't know, but there are attorneys who work for free for those in need who could help you if you need the help. You do need to get some help as soon as possible. You need either a will or a trust set up for your Mom. We have a trust and it allows for your Mom to stipulate what she wants done with her home and property when she passes. You need to speak to her and if it were me I would ask her to please put in a clause that would allow me to at least remain in the house for 1 year after she passes. This will allow you time to get your head together and decide what you are going to do. In reality she should give you the house for taking care of her, when no one else seems to care.

I would ask for disposition of the personal property some time like 3 to 6 months after Mom's death so you can sort through everything unless you can do it now prior to her death and tag everything, like guns go to Bill, China to Sue, Tools to Bob.

Unfortunately when you have family like this, it is going to be a "free for all" when Mom dies and most likely, "first come, first served" so you desperately need legal documents and possibly a restraining order to keep these members from ransacking the house.

If you are strong enough you need to obtain her Power of Attorney for financial and healthcare decisions. Just a warning as this could become a war among family with you trying to hold them at bay.

My sister told my mother to her face, "When you die, I will have hit the lottery! I am taking my money and leaving here! She screamed it twice and I was shocked as was my mother. You can live in what you believe to be a decent family, but when it comes to death and money, the worst side of everyone seems to come out and they act like a bunch of vultures.

This absolutely MUST be taken care of right now and all siblings need to know what has happened and what will and will not be taking place even if you have to have the attorney draw up a letter and mail it to each of them. Your life will be utter hell and you will be run over with zero say if you do not take care of this NOW!

Good Luck my heart goes out to you!

vstefans Feb 2014
Unfortunately, yes - documents and legal expertise are sorely needed here. Hoep it is not too hard or too expensive to sort it all out. Bless you!

sunflo2 Feb 2014
Yes, get mom to add legal addendum regarding tenancy following her death if that is what you want. Otherwise, if it isn't stipulated in writing, sibs can throw you out, and force sale of property and even division of the estate.

LindaH52 Feb 2014
countrymouse, when dad died POA is no longer in affect and I couldn't do anything about what she did. My brothers and I tried.

Patathome01 Feb 2014
My mother's estate was set up about 6 years ago when she had a sound mind when she was 89. I am so happy this was done, because today, Mom's very forgetful and not really able to make many decisions about who receives what, including our condo that she thinks she owns 100% when she and I both own it jointly. I live in it, and Mom lives in an assisted living facility.

pipruby Feb 2014
ALSO, if she has income (social security) see if she can contribute to the expenses and/or pay you compensation for care taking.

Countrymouse Feb 2014
Charles, if you have evidence that your sister misappropriated your father's money under the smokescreen of her POA, you should bring it to the attention of the relevant authorities.

And if she cleaned him out, of what did she have no control when your father died and you were his executor?

Sosad has stated that her mother is of sound mind and also intimated that her mother is no pushover. This lady is not simply going to do as she's told by her children; so who said she wants them there when she gets round to sorting out her affairs? Sos, see your friendly attorney and find out what needs doing - you'll feel better for getting advice and knowing the rules.

LindaH52 Feb 2014
If she doesn't have a will or POA, all children should be there when they are done. My sister went behind our backs and had a POA done and cleaned Dad out. Luckily I was the executor and she had no control after dad died.

Reverseroles Feb 2014
Who is the DPOA? Regardless, you need to get to an attorney asap! First visits are usually free, just go because you will be so sorry you didnt.Best of Luck!

ferris1 Feb 2014
First, I want to know who has your mother's POA. If she has a sound mind, then she needs to get all her ducks in a row, appoint someone to act on her behalf in financial and medical decisions. At this point in time I cannot answer your question because I don't have enough information. Who owns the home? Who is on the title? What does your mother say about your siblings? I suggest you all sit down with your mother and discuss what she wants done with her possessions. That way everyone will have their say in front of her and she can make a decision what to do. It might be a good idea to have a therapist, social worker or attorney present so there are ground rules about the conduct of the family members. Often these meetings can get very hot and emotional.

Countrymouse Feb 2014
What happens to the house after her passing is entirely up to your mother. As a matter of common sense, most people want to leave their affairs in reasonable order. And although she doesn't have to tell you what she decides to do, it isn't an unreasonable question for you to ask.

Having said all that, it is of course an extremely awkward subject that many people do leave alone - and afterwards are very sorry they did. In your position, I think I'd suggest to my mother that I put her in touch with an attorney who will help her sort everything out so that she need never think about it again. I'd limit my involvement to drafting a check list of subjects that need to be addressed, and give a copy each to the attorney and my mother. Shut them in a room and leave them to it. Check afterwards that the attorney is satisfied that mother had been concentrating and was content with her decisions. For myself, look ahead and make sensible plans about what to do and where to live in the future, making sure that they were not based on any expectations about the estate.

Let's assume your mother either dies intestate or shares her estate equally between all four of you. Who has rights to enter the house will be up to the executor, whether appointed by the state or by your mother. It would be sensible and practical if it were you, but you can't force that. Let's further assume that the house will be sold immediately. I'm not going to say it's never happened - who would dare? - but I don't think in general even uncaring siblings attempt to evict their sister on the day of their mother's demise. Besides, even if your siblings might like to chuck you out instanter, houses don't clean and market themselves…

Actually, you know what? You're really crossing bridges before you've come to them. Choose your attorney with care. Think about the specifics that need to be decided on. Take it from there.

Madeaa Feb 2014
I would sit down with mom and let her know that in order for you to continue staying and caring for her that you need to be protected. If not done already, POAs need to be done, will needs to be done before anything happens mentally or even further physically with her. I would get a right of residence which means even if she herself wanted to sell the house you have a right of residence and I don't think a new buyer would want you as an addition, no offense intended. Get these things done they are parmount, and do not waste valuable energy or time in trying to figure out your relatives, protect yourself and that means take care of your welfare too.

pamstegma Feb 2014
You could have mom stipulate in the will that although the property is part of her estate, you would have life tenant status after her death. Or you buy the house with your 25% and pay off the other 75% with a mortgage. Talk to a lawyer to get it written up so you are protected.

nsjmk77 Feb 2014
Definitely see an attorney. There are tax laws about the value of the house on the day she passes rather than waiting to sell. I had to touch on these things when my dad passed. It is critical that you talk to an attorney and get things in writing.

akdaughter Feb 2014
Does your mom have a will? If so, a statement can be added outlining what happens with the house. In my opinion, it should outline how long you have before you need to vacate the house, and, if you wish to stay and own the house, how that will be handled. If you wish to stay, perhaps your siblings could receive a larger share of the remaining estate assets in lieu of a portion of the house.

If mom doesn't have a will, get one written ASAP. Either way, see an attorney.

LOUISE44 Feb 2014
I am not answering your question legally, but emotionally - that just is the pits, I have little patience with non care giving relatives that feel that they are owed something.
First of all I would consult a lawyer and have some kind of document done. If your Mom is mentally sound that should not be a problem, and even if she wishes to leave things equally - she should certainly be able to stipulate that you get to stay in the home for 6 months or a year after her passing before selling the house - I think that would be more than fair since you have undertaken her care.

Do they say those things to your Mom and you - or just you?

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