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Nkclhccd Asked April 2017

Is there anything we can do?

My father in law just passed away. He was wheel chair bound from a stoke and other medical issues. His nurse from the V.A. hospital talked him into moving to a house 4 yrs ago and she would be his home nurse. Well now that he has passed, we find out she is on the checking account as a joint account, and on the life insurance policy. 2 weeks before he died she became his POA with out us knowing, so we were not notified that he was in the hospital when he died. She has the house keys and wont give them up so we can clean out the house, she says it is all hers. Is there anything we can do?  She did not live with him, as she is married and lives with her husband.

Shane1124 Apr 2017
Despicable that some people just wait in the wings and plan to rip off elderly vulnerable people. Unfortunately a lot of the time they get away with it.
I hope the police and her agency investigate and throw this low life bottom feeder in jail. Often they cover their tracks very well- hoping she didn't cross all the I'd and t's.
Pond scum.

Nkclhccd Apr 2017
no additional help, he was able to care for himself. She was with him like 6 to 8 hrs a day in and out. She kept his alcohol and cigarettes coming, so he was happy. We have a lawyer involved, her work is notified and the wheels are turning on the lies. and Yes she says that she was told everything was hers. We were told to just be patient and let the lawyer and police work. Looks like she has done this before too.

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Rainmom Apr 2017
I imagine it's a matter of proof - why they don't arrest her. She's probably telling the police your FIL gave her the items she did return and claiming she never saw any rings, gold etc.

Which brings me back to a question I asked earlier- if she has a home with a husband in it and she lived there at least some of the time - who looked after your FIL when she wasn't there? If there was additional help they might be able to provide you with some concret information regarding your FILs personal belongings.

Nkclhccd Apr 2017
well the police made her give us the keys to the house, but she had already emptied it. Police talked to her and she returned some things, but all personal stuff is gone, like his marine awards and ring, all paper work gone. Deleted everything off his phone. We meet with a lawyer in the morning. I don´t understand why she is not in jail. Just the fact that all his meds are gone, oh she even returned a tv, but it wasnt his, his was a newer one, and we got an old one. Did return his wallet with 3 dollars in it and his v.a. card, He always had cash in his house and wallet. He also bought gold and silver, My husband is just so upset, losing all his dads personal things. She even destroyed a bedroom set, it is just trash now. THere should be laws about home nurses and what they are allowed to do. I am just baffled that the police dont arrest her. They were with her when she returned the stuff to the house. So if you steal from someones home and then bring some stuff back you dont get arrested. I am just so frustrated. She has his checking account, his life insurance why does she feel she should also steal personal things. AGGHHHHH

Dadscaregiver1 Apr 2017
I would investigate to see if she has taken advantage of other elders in her care. Google her name and also look for complaints registered at the State Board Of Nursing. You need to file a complaint with them, the VA, police and Elder Services.

Rainmom Apr 2017
If she works for an agency chance are there are all kinds of rules regarding accepting gifts, handling money etc. while this might be enough for her to loose her job, there is a chance she might have signed some sort of contract or agreement in order to work there - which may be to your benefit if you challenge her claim to bank accounts, insurance money, etc.

Nkclhccd Apr 2017
funeral will be in a few weeks, so sister in law can be there. He was cremated so time is not a problem.  We are going to contact the police and talk to her boss at the agency.

Oklahoma Apr 2017
Also you could tell her you are going to file a complaint to the State Board of Nursing if she doesn't cooperate.

Oklahoma Apr 2017
You didn't mention if there was a funeral yet but she can't make claims that she owns everything and keep you from entering a rental that is probably in his name without showing some kind of paperwork. Have you seen the power of attorney? Can you get the landlord to let you in? She's probably busy going through all his stuff and moving money behind the scenes. I would call the police. If she has a nursing license she should cooperate as a complaint might cause her to lose her license.

Nkclhccd Apr 2017
The house was a rental, we just want in to get his stuff and paper work, but it has been a week and I am sure she has cleared anything we will need. He was at an OK state of mind. He was an alcholic, we tried and tried to get him treatment, but she kept him happy with his drinks. I am sure knowing him, she flirted alot and kept him drunk, not that she forced him to drink. She knew that family relations were not great because of the drinking. and used that to her benifit. My husband had seen him 3 days before he died and did not mention that he changed the POA. I like the idea of finding the attorney who helped change it. We wonder how many life insurance policies she has on him. We will probrably never know. No 401K or retirement. Thanks for the advice.

Oklahoma Apr 2017
Did FIL have a retirement account or 401k? Her name is probably on that as well.

Oklahoma Apr 2017
I'm sorry to hear this. Something very similar happened to my Father. You will probably hear her say that's what he wanted and then she will become a victim if anyone questions her actions. I can't believe people out there that are not family members have the nerve to go behind the families backs and convince helpless elders to give their assets to them. You might say that your family needs all of his paperwork arrange the funeral and to settle the estate. Name a time and place to meet and if she doesn't agree or respond call the police. It looks like what she has done is put all the non probate assets in her name so she can take the accounts upon passing of FIL. Also, she probably has the deed to the house now. In my case the person also took my Father to a lawyer had the POA created as well as the will. Without any family members present. He has dementia. Once you get the paperwork have a lawyer give a free first time consultation. She obviously knew what she was doing and how to do it. I'm sure your FIL didn't come up with this by himself. If you do get the paperwork and proof of POA call the lawyer that created it and ask them who this Nurse said she was to your FIL. Was she posing as a significant other?  If a will was created it will probably state the nature of their relationship. 

Evermore99 Apr 2017
That woman sound suspicious. Run and get an elder attorney because it sounds like a case of elder abuse. I don't know of too many people who would "befriend" an elderly person unless there would be something to gain. I don't know how substantial your father's assets were but they must have been substantial enough.

jeannegibbs Apr 2017
There are so many questions here. Were the bank account and insurance beneficiary changed in the two weeks the CG was his POA? Or long before?

You don't mention anything about FIL being mentally compromised. So I assume that he made the changes and that you are thinking it might have been under duress -- that CG Nurse put pressure on him or exercised undue influence. I think you will need evidence that this happened. What can you point to suggest unethical behavior?

You can't just waltz into a bank and say "Please add me to Joe Doak's checking and savings accounts." Your FIL would have had to be there in person, which is perfectly possible in a wheel chair. So, assuming he was there and changed it, what did she have over him to coerce that?

It is similar with beneficiaries of an insurance policy. It may not require personal appearance but you can't just dash off an email and say "change the beneficiary to me, please." You father would have had to authorize that.

On what basis does she claim that the house and contents are all hers? Is that in a will? Or does she claim an oral agreement? Was her name put on the deed? When?

Please understand, I am not trying to argue that the Nurse was an upright citizen, devoted to caring for one at-home client and FIL thought she should be rewarded for her devotion. (That is possible, of course.) But I think to change anything you will have to prove malfeasance on her part. That will take evidence. I do understand why you are outraged, but that is not enough to change the beneficiary or account ownership.

You (or your spouse) will need a lawyer to guide you on this.

Rainmom Apr 2017
...AND - it's my understanding that a POA can only change a beneficiary to a life insurance policy IF that power is specifically spelled out in the POA document. Unfortunately, it's unlikely this woman is going to share the document with you willingly so you might not know what powers were and weren't allowed without a court order.

Additionally- if the POA document does grant the power to change insurance beneficiaries and she changed it to herself - she could be placed under an investigation by the insurance company. Doing that - changing beneficiary to herself is generally considered unethical - an abuse of power and if challenged could negate the change.

Rainmom Apr 2017
Is there a will? If so, that ought to determine who the house and its contents belongs to. If there is no will - probate must be filed with a judge appointing an executor.

Two things to keep in mind - POA ends with death. So once your FIL passsed, she no longer has the authority to act on his behalf. Although, it's very likely the joint checking will divert to her solely - and any other account she may be on. Just hope she is not named as executor of the will. You will likely need to get an attorney and/or your local sherif involved to get the house keys.
The second thing is that POA is not allowed - in any state - to make changes to a will. So unless she took your FIL to an attorney for a new will or changes to an existing one - if there is one - the will, will stand as originally written in a court of law.

Good luck - I think your gonna need it as this sounds like you're going to have an uphill battle on your hands.

P.s.  I'm curious- if she wasn't living in the house and had a husband at home I'm assuming she spent time with - who looked after your FIL when she was at home with her hubby?

jeannegibbs Apr 2017
Do you believe she coerced him into these things? Did FIL have dementia?

What is your evidence that FIL did not do these things of his own free will?

What was the nature of your relationship with FIL while he lived in that house and had that woman as a nurse?

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