Move Mom to her own apartment?

I’ve been where you are. Three thoughts. 1) Even with a pill minder which has to be filled by someone, or pill pack—it’s complicated for older folks. You won’t notice it right away if she mixes it up. 2) Every time you move her she may lose some ground. 3) Have you priced out the meal delivery, laundry, cleaning, etc.? Reliability with elder help is VERY sketchy, and there are hourly minimums.
Best of luck!

About the diarrhea, My dear friend had diarrhea for years and the specialists only prescribed drugs as a solution. She tried probiotics like Align with no results. Finally, a functional medicine doctor recommended the Probiotic brand Xymogen and it has literally eliminated the diarrhea. But you have to find a local doctor who sells the brand- that’s the only downside.
Afterwards, another friend who has Alzheimer’s and has also had their gallbladder removed tried the Xymogen brand and it didn’t clear up their diarrhea.
I don’t know if it would work for your Mom but it might be worth a try.

What happens as she declines in health? Perhaps it's not wise to move her.

Thanks everyone for your feedback. I truly appreciate it.

Finances were obviously a big reason I started looking into this, and I guess I got a little hopeful after seeing the new senior apartments in town. I needed to take a step back and realize mom wasn't asking for this, it was me wanting to improve her situation.

I like to think mom is doing well and can manage on her own, but the reality is I only see her a few hours every week or two. So I really don't know what her day to day routines and requirements are. Then there are the underlying health concerns I shouldn't overlook.

After 20 years apart I had accepted mom was gone and I'd probably never see her again. Then she had the stroke and my life went from no contact, to full on managing everything for her. It has been an adjustment, and admittedly I didn't want any part of caring for her in the beginning. But, with no one else to look out for her, necessity changed my attitude.

Our lives are already quite busy caring for our two moms. Adding even more responsibilities is probably not the wisest decision at this time in our life.

Anyway, thanks again everyone.

After reading all you have written about your mom's past I would be inclined to leave her there. Also change can be very difficult and if she seems content better not to rock that boat. I’m inclined to feel based on her health she will need more care rather than less with afib and clogged arteries. It’s possible she may have some vascular dementia. One reason she seems to be doing well is probably the care and feeling of security. Your description of her past housing situation also is a red flag for her being on her own. We often so want the best for our parents and for them to be happy but when I catch myself thinking these things I have to ask my self why I’m wishing this. Usually it’s because I still see my dad as capable when he's not. I do not like that he's ended up in the NH instead of AL but it truly is the best place for him. Had he gone back to ALF, he would have had bigger issues. So I personally had to make piece with his tiny room, etc. People's lives shrink as they age and truthfully they often don’t mind that they live in smaller places. We are the one's who have the issue with it.. Hope that makes sense.

Hearing that her home wasn’t being taken care of is another red flag that living alone wasn’t working for whatever reason. I would add that to the list I made below. It sounds to me like someone who is a pretty good fit for AL. It takes the pressure off of her. Especially if she has dealt with mental illness throughout her life. It sounds like she has just the right amount of support where she is now.

Mountain, that is good to know that she wasn't abused, more than likely.

I watched a PBS show about a woman that developed a mental illness in her 20s, she ended up passing away in the winter in an empty house, she had wandered away from her facility and she believed she was okay, she kept a journal of her life. She knew but didn't know, maybe that is where your mom lives.

I think keeping her where she seems contented is a great idea.

I promise it is easier for you and your wife. Being the son is so much better than being the caregiver.

Well done! Amazing how talking can change our perceptions.

I think the senior living apartment is the right thing. I'm a 7 minute walk from my mom in her assisted living and that really helps me to be able to check on her daily. She has Alzheimer's, so has to be there. Your mom doesn't seem to need the care she is paying for. She could have someone come for a couple hours every day to make sure she gets her meals and remind her of her medications. Maybe she'll make friends there, since the people will most likely be younger and be able to be in conversation with her.

I just want to touch on the financial portion. If your father or mother served on the military during war time they might be eligible for financial benefits. I just went through an organization called American Veterans Association for my mom. They helped with all the paper work and now she will receive a monthly allowance. It will really help defray costs of her dementia care facility. Dad served in WW2. Check them out online.

Good Morning,
My only thought is that your Mom is where there are people around all the time.  Not 'in her face' , but there to notice if something is off what it should be.
You mentioned that your Mom had lain on the floor for 4 days before being found after the stroke.  That would be my answer...  That could happen again if she lives alone again.  The other thing, should there be the slightest start of dementia, a move could really speed up the pace!!
If she does not beg to move, and she is safe and well looked after, I would leave it be and pray she lives long enough to run out of money!!!
God Bless You for being the caring person you are that you are looking out for possible problems.  No one knows what can happen in in 6-7 years, though.

Mountainsoft, if you haven't talked to your mom, wait! Talk to her doctors and get there input first. They may be saying all is well because she has care at hand. If she were on her own would that be different?

I went through and am still going through the, got so much better with all the care, don't need care anymore. I cringe when my phone rings because I know the train wreck is coming, just don't know when.

Just curious, do you think her dead husband could have been the cause of her isolating herself? That is what abusers do to their victims. If that could be a yes, she may come out of her hole more and more, it takes a long time to recover from decades of abuse and she might need more time. Just a thought may be way off base. I would just hate to see her loose the progress made, she is after all socializing more now.

Such a tough spot to be in for sure.

Best of luck getting the doctors input.

I just read your post on why the gap in relationship. That is rough, my friend. I am sure you experienced a sense of loss there for many years. That creates a hole in the heart... no one wants to feel abandoned by a parent, even as adults, even if they don’t mean to hurt you.

In light of the info you just posted, being TOO empathetic may backfire on you. Also, what boehmc said... YOU are not responsible for her finances.

You may want to tease out gently how much of this is really on you and how much of this is about maybe you having a mom again or you trying to protect her, save her, fix her world. (I know this feeling intimately, I am not trying to condescend here. It is a very powerful urge if you are the kid that people relied on or had to be independent and fix things for others.) After reading more details, I can honestly say that you are doing such a GOOD JOB with what you have in place. Truly, you are. You are caring for her in a reasonable and kind manner and have done a really hard thing to let it go and allow the two of you to enjoy a decent relationship.

Well, my book for the morning is complete, lol. I wish you the best as you move forward.

What does your mother say? Ask her what she thinks about this ALF, and how it compares with how she would like to live in a perfect world. Then don't talk, listen. You might want to spread this over many conversations.

It's really that you're ripping through her money faster than necessary that's bugging you, is it? Nothing wrong with that, you're wise to give it thought.

I think that if I were you I would not want to tinker with her for now, at least. Her vascular surgeon is pleased with her, but she has A Fib and she has had a stroke. She has this chronic diarrhoea. She tends to isolate herself.

Speaking of which - I don't want to intrude, but her twenty years of self-isolation, and thirteen years of no contact at all - what's going on?

At the moment, you have this delicately balanced person under control in a safe, familiar place. I think you have to be very certain it's going to help before you make any major changes.

Lots of good thoughts from others, both pros and cons. One thought... I have learned to be careful with the “I know I would prefer to...” line of thinking. It is so natural and comes from a good-hearted place. You are a good son to care about her dignity. However, it can lead to actions that get you stuck in an unnecessary quagmire of guilt and second-guessing, especially because you are younger and able, and she is older and post-stroke.

It doesn’t sound like your Mom is chomping at the bit to get out. Nor at 73 and ‘mentally sharp’ is she doing what needs to be done to make that happen.

And if you haven’t been in contact, I would imagine there is a reason. If she gets less mentally sharp, you may encounter that reason again in spades. Right now she has you and the AL staff. If you are her only support system, you and your family WILL be the ones to bear the heavy weight of any decline. And secondary strokes are very, very common.

She isn’t socializing, she has had falls, diarrhea is an ongoing issue (this may be an after-effect of the stroke), you are concerned about whether she would eat properly, someone else dispenses her meds, someone else does some of her laundry and you have to manage her finances. This doesn’t sound like very healthy and mentally sharp for a 73-year-old. I mean that kindly. From this perspective, it sounds like AL is the proper fit at the proper time. A small space sounds like what she needs. She does have access to common areas, she isn’t trapped.

I would imagine many of us here are a bit envious that someone is where they need to be, lol.

One PS on the diarrhea, that could be a post-stroke issue that just won’t go away. We experienced that and since then have heard of it many times over. I am always amazed doctors don’t mention it more.

One fall or change in her condition could move you into the role of cleaner-upper extraordinaire... those messes are very physically demanding. Very. I know that is an “if”, but that is one thing that would rock her world and yours very quickly if she were in an IL situation.

Right now, it sounds like she has all of the “props” in place that many of us here know help an elder seem to be functioning at maybe a higher level than they are. The heavy lifting is done by others, so they seem to be sailing smoothly. You can set some of those things up in an IL, but YOU will likely have a lot more work coordinating people, missed shifts of caregivers, she may kick them out (you won’t know if this is going to happen until she is fully moved), emergency diarrhea clean up, and no real back up in the form of staff. You have to decide if you are ok with that. Right now, she has people and a routine.

Just things to keep in mind. If she was determined to leave and had investigated all of it HERSELF (her saying it wishfully and actually pursuing it are two different things) and started to set things up, I would be much more inclined to see an IL move as a good step. But it sounds like you are thinking you have to initiate this. That isn’t usually a good sign.

It sounds like you may not be close enough to her (and I don’t mean that in an ugly way, day to day knowing someone doesn’t usually happen with those big gaps) to know whether she isn’t as mentally sharp as you think. If you are really considering this move, I would probe and probe and probe. If you want ideas on how to do that, I can add more later, as can others, I am sure.

Money is important. She could outlive hers. But, if she does have to go on Medicaid, it will be 6-7 years down the road. She may be in a different facility needing a higher level of care and need much less pin money. Many facilities have cable for the residents, she may not need a phone, or care about her nails, or... she may not have everything, but she would be cared for. For now, less redundant groceries means less cost.

Only you know this situation... I just wanted to throw out there that during that time frame MANY things could change.

Think about all the extra time moving her into her own apartment is going to cost YOU. Part of assisted living is helping to decrease the worry and the burden on the caregiver. You didn't put the financial picture together to take care of your parents, they did. If their money runs out and they go on Medicaid, that is totally on them, not on you. You have your own life to live, and you need to live it without worrying if she's taking her meds, eating healthy, etc. Arranging for all those services is going to take it's toll on you. And will she willingly move back into AL once she needs it?

Wow...no contact from mom for 20 years? That is odd...unless you all had a falling out. Just not the norm. Did she have cognitive testing and if so was her score normal? If she didn’t have you considered doing so. As you probably know, lack of socializing is a causative factor in dementia.
Will your mom wear a medical alert device. Will she allow a camera in her apartment should you need to check on her safety (not to spy)? I will say with your report of her clogged arteries the chance of another stroke is high. So weigh the odds of having her more independent and then if she has another stroke...going the Medicaid route for LTC. It’s a hard decision.

Some good responses. Just a counterpoint - what happens 12 months down the road if some event changes things and she really needs assisted living?

I think the senior apartment is fine. Plus it’s closer to you. That alone is a big plus!

You have every very right to be concerned about money. More so, than most here with older parents. My mom is 93! Your mom is still relatively young.

In regard to the diarrhea: psyllium supplements like metamucil can add bulk to the stool and help some types of diarrhea, adding a probiotic may be helpful too.

If Mom was making her own breakfast and lunch didn't you already have that expense? Dinner shouldn't cost that much. Have you talked to her doctor? Have you discussed it with her? Maybe likes the AL?

The plus is she will be closer to you. Maybe dinner with you a few times a week. Some 55 and up have activities. Make a list, pros and cons. If there are more pros then go with the 55 and up. I will be 70 and not sure I would want to be in an AL at my age. Mom may do better on her own.

Her problem...does she drink coffee. Apple juice did a number on Mom. I stopped both and things improved. What is she eating? Has she been checked for Crohns?

If she is of sound mind and competent it is a good idea to get her input.

Did you ask any of her doctors if they thought she could now transition back to independent living? I would definitely contact them for their input.

She was very blessed to have been able to recover from this stroke, so you know, it was probably the clogged artery in her neck that caused the stroke, not bad eating habits. My grandma had a series of strokes from the clogged artery in her neck and it was never recovered from, she went from fine on Friday to full blown dementia on Monday.

There are things that you should price out so you have a realistic idea of what she is actually paying for. I imagine that the AL comes in daily for light housekeeping, they make the bed, empty trash, sweep or run the vacuum, clean any messes in the bathroom. So you would need a weekly cleaner if mom isn't tidy or has incontinence issues. Daily cleaning only takes a few moments, weekly or biweekly takes a couple+ hours, get pricing for weekly, how much for a home chef to come in and do meals that she will eat, I say home chef because you are worried about her eating and some meal delivery is garbage and she wouldn't eat it even if delivered. Laundry is no big deal if she isn't incontinent, you will be changing her bedding, AL does this and it should be twice a week and as needed. Pills can be pocketed for ease of understanding or you can get a dispenser that spits out pills at scheduled times. In home care should be checked into, you say it will be cheaper, I wouldn't count on that, research for your area and be realistic in the number of hours, my area has a 3 hour minimum and a 25.00 hourly rate, 75.00 daily minimum adds up quickly and it may be more in your area.

Her self isolation is going to be the biggest nut to turn, she will decline without socialization. It is a proven fact that we need human contact to be our healthiest. Does the new apartment have any social activities or is there some place close that she can participate with others regularly to have social connections? Is there a senior facility that offers group meals in your area?

I believe that some people can transition out of AL when they were admitted due to a medical condition that has since been recovered from. She has the financial wherewithal to do whatever she wants, so I say go for it. Just do your homework and include her in all decisions, if she isn't able to participate in these decisions she probably shouldn't live alone with no supports in place.

If or when she runs out of money you modify her expenses and you set up a miller trust or a qualified income trust through an attorney and that will help her qualify for aid. But that is far down the road based on your info and who knows what will be available that far down the road.

Let us know what happens.

OMG! Yes, do it! I wish I had had the luxury of that solution!

If your mom is doing well, I say go for it. Yup, the move is gonna kill ya but its a short term thing getting it done. Hire help.
The paring down of things is where the problem comes in- in my case that was the worst of it. 4 bedroom 3100 sq ft home PACKED TO THE MAX- down to a 1 bedroom apt. I had 3 weeks, to pick, pack and clean....then transport a 91 yr old, very pissed woman 1500 miles with her stuff. She would not let anyone in to help me either....everyone was accused of stealing. I thought I was gonna die! The fighting was epic! but if you can get by that, your on the right track.

Can your mom drive? If not, and she is in the 55+ community, do they provide any transportation? If not would it be left to you take her shopping, MD appointments, etc? (Just something to consider)

You mention a concern about her perhaps not eating regularly if on her own. That is a valid concern. You also mention your retirement plans for a few years from now. Would your mom expect you to "cater" to her once you are no longer working? You say she does "some" laundry. Does the AL do the bulk of her laundry? If she moved to a 55+ would you end up doing her laundry?

Another concern with living in a regular apartment is missing the socialization piece. Does she have friends that she will plan outings with?

I get that is goes against the grain to pay for service not being used. I'd feel the same. And yes 71 is younger than the average assisted living resident. As far as medication management, she may not need it now but there may come a time when she does.

Are there more affordable ALs you would consider that maybe are a little further away (say 1 or 2 hours). That would still be close enough for you visit her often and keep tabs.

Tough decisions and I wish you the best.

It depends entirely on your mom. Is she capable of living on her own? Many people that are 50 can't. My great grandma lived in her own apt until she was 98.

Given her relatively young age and the fact the reason she she entered AL was a physical difficulty that has since been overcome I think that moving to a 55+/ independent living community sounds like a great idea.

Many 55+ communities also have activities priced into the monthly rent but probably less costly than AL since there is usually no medical/health services. 55+ sounds like a good fit for her as long as she is healthy and mentally competent.

Your mom is younger than many in assisted living. I see your concerns about running out of money. Any other sources that you could possibly tap into, aid and assistance from veterans program? Anything else? Tough situation.

Talk to her nurses and doctors about about her health to get a better picture too. May help you decide what is best. Take care.

It was less expensive for my mother to live in an independent living facility ( utilities, food, house keeping weekly, transportation) than in a senior apartment where we would have had to supply all of that. You can’t just go by rent. By I would see if there is an independent living rather than assisted living facility. No nursing care and usually cheaper. $3800 is a lot for a studio, my mother had a 2 bedroom for $3800 and found it too big so moved into a cheaper one bedroom for about 1k less. Check around