It'll be costly, a legal hassle and time consuming but you can petition to for guardianship. Guardianship trumps any POA. But if you sibling fights that petition and you two can't come to an agreement, the judge may just award guardianship to the state.
I haven’t hired a lawyer yet due to a shortage of funds because I know my brother will fight me tooth & nail. He also had my mom rewrite her trust & DPOA @ 95 years of age with dementia removing me from both completely .
She had everything set up 20 years ago but he had it all changed to benefit himself. The police, my Senator & APS all told me I should get a lawyer but I just don’t have the money especially with the new DPOA stating he can use moms money.
He has completely broken her trust & gone against her longtime wishes.
Be careful with your POA sibling............some like the control they have over people & it feeds their ego! My sibling with DPOA hasn’t let myself or my kids see or speak to my mom for 2 years now.
Yes - yesterday, I read, in an article on this website, that sometimes when a sibling becomes a POA and shuts out other siblings from care giving decision making or even relating healthcare information, it is because the POA sibling takes the care giving responsibility so seriously, that it becomes an integral part of their identity, or may be filling a need to have power or control over their life. I know my POA sibiling and his wife have just become empty-nested, with their 4th and youngest child now in college. With his primary parenting life-role winding down, he may be (even unconsciously) transferring that void of responsibility to the POA caregiver role. (Arm-chair psychologist speculation?)
Jada824, I am VERY sorry about your situation with your DPOA sibling and your mom. It seems odd that a DPOA could barr contact - have you consulted an attorney on this matter?
Kanguiano, I'm sorry for the way communication has fallen apart for your family. I know how stressful and upsetting it can be, especially when everyone is trying to their best in a difficult situation.
Reading your post and your comments below, there is one key point which is unavoidable, and that is confidentiality. Your parents' medical records are strictly confidential, and without either their consent or that of their legal representative, *none* of the information should have been shared with you.
This is not a reflection on your efforts to understand their physical and mental health challenges and do your best to support them; it really is a cut-and-dried, black-and-white issue.
You seem very conscientious about really getting to grips in detail with what is going on, and I'm with you on that! :) I like exact information too. But sometimes ambiguity and uncertainty are just there in the territory and you have to live with them.
This shouldn't stop you being an excellent visitor and contributing to your parents' quality of life. Listen to your parents, use questions rather than statements, pretend you don't know anything about how they're feeling on a given day and let them guide the conversation.
If it's any consolation (see my avatar for how I feel about it!) I just started a new job and got my ears chewed off in the first week for "trying to solve everything." I have spent the time since then keeping my mouth zipped shut and turning purple, but I have learned that it is better to listen than to speak.
All the same, you have done nothing wrong, nothing to feel guilty about. It's unfortunate that this huge row blew up in front of your mother but I don't think anyone is to blame - feelings boiled over, as they do under such stress.
Start afresh, and focus on being a warm, positive presence for your parents; and maybe, as time goes on, a support to your brother that he will come to appreciate better.
Thank you so much for your empathetic and informational response! I can't tell you how much it helps to just to have some positive, supportive feedback from an objective person like yourself, who can look at the situation without all the emotional, family dynamics and drama!
Dear Faeriefiles, Thank you for this suggestion - I have tried to do exactly as you have suggested, since being cutoff from medical information from the care facility staff about my parents (now both have been diagnosed with dementia). I have just tried to enjoy visiting with my parents when I am at their facility. I definitely do not need to control any information about my parent's medical care and treatment. I initially was maybe a little overenthusiastic with providing suggestions, but had good intentions of only trying to help, not be in control. At this point, I would just appreciate being informed if my parents have a dramatic decline in the stage of their disease, especially if that necessitates a change in how I need to interact with them, when visiting, such as, not bringing up certain past family events that my parents do not remember anymore or certain extended family members or friends that one or both of my parents don't remember any more, as to not embarrass my parents (I heard this can be a common issue with dementia patients).
There are two good answers already here. I will add another thought. Maybe just letting the sibling who is POA handle the medical stuff is good enough. Maybe you can just let it go, relax, and enjoy your parent time without burdening yourself with their medical care. Do you really need all the details?
Personally I would beg. I would plead. I would promise just about anything to be informed of just the basics, the plan moving forward, the choices they are faced with making. I would not argue with the decisions made by the POA for health care, as the decisions are theirs to be made, and they were chosen to make them. I might gently say where and when if I differed, but I would be supportive and would recognize that the choices ultimately are theirs to make. I would be thankful to them for taking on a very difficult job. I am assuming, of course that this person is not a criminal bent on harm and cruelty to the parent. You haven't said that he or she is. So sorry for your pain. I hope your parent is unaware of any warring between siblings over them. There is nothing so heartbreaking as someone old and weak being torn in the middle between the children they love.
I have been afraid of asking for information, since I have since been told by friends that it seems that the problem was me asking too many questions, asking for too much medical information, and giving too many suggestions as to my father's (the demential parent in memory care) care and treatment. Also, frankly, I have been traumatized by the nasty in-person heated argument my POA sibling and I had in front of my mother (see my response to GardenArtist), a year ago, last June. In fact, I have had trauma-like flashbacks of the incident over the past 16 months.
I initially backed WAY off in visiting my parents in frequency in the summer and fall of 2018 (I live 4 hrs away), and during that time, the trauma of the incident basically took its toll on my 15 year marriage, and my husband and I separated and are now in the middle of a divorce. I began gradually to call and go see my parents again, in winter, 2018, and winter-spring 2019, but the visits were very awkward and tense, as I didn't know what all of my parent's caregiving staff had been told about how to interact/not interact with me regarding my parents. Instead, I just concentrated on visiting with my parents, and tried to "...lay low and go with the flow." Things have gradually gotten less icy with my POA brother, but I have learned that he seems to need total control as to all care and treatment decisions as to my parents, and I have not dared to ask any questions regarding their condition, or make any suggestions.
It definitely has been a very painful, and confusing experience, with me feeling somewhat like the "blacksheep" sibling, and that I have somehow done something wrong, but no one whom I have spoken to about this experience seems to be able to provide an explanation as to the cause of my being cut off from medical information about my dementia parents (now both have dementia) from the care facility nursing staff.
It would help if more information provided, but responding to just your question, I would ask what the relationship is between you and your sibling that has resulted in this apparent frictional situation?
This is a question based on relationships that are frequently addressed here.
Do some analysis of your relationship, ask yourself what caused it, sustained it, and what, if anything can be done to address it, modify it, and/or work around it?
It's unfortunate that siblings fall into these situations, and I know that some situations can't be corrected. But if not, perhaps you can address the underlying reasons why you're being cut out.
My POA sibling and I have always had a good relationship and have never had an argument (beyond childish spats in high school - he is 2 yrs older) before the phone argument that led to my being cut off from medical information about my both of my parents, actually, who are in different stages of dementia, from the nursing staff at their care facility. My being cut off came about 1 yr and 4 months ago, after my father had been admitted to memory care about 7 wks before at the beginning of April, 2018. At that time it was unclear as to which sibling had the healthcare POA - this brother (the middle of 3 siblings) told us (the other 2) that the POA document my parents drew up had my parents as POA for each other, than the POA went from oldest to youngest sibling (I am the youngest). My middle brother (now the POA sibling) was closest in proximity to my parents, and was the initial emergency contact for the retirement community staff, so he was initially involved in getting my father admitted to memory care. I am a teacher, and have summers off, so after the end of the school year, I began to become more involved in helping my parents with the transition (my mother living alone for the first time), and I began to ask a lot of questions of my, now POA sibling, as to the testing, diagnosis and treatment options presented to my parent (father) admitted to memory care. My sibling did not know the answer to many of my questions, so I began to do a lot of research on the disease on the internet and made questions to the nursing staff, when I went to visit my parents ( I live about 4 hours away). The nursing staff was initially very receptive and for the questions I asked about my father's history of diagnosis, treatment and prognosis of his dementia for which they did not have an answer, they promised to look the information up in my father's medical chart (my parents had signed a document, when they moved into the facility, that the nursing staff would have access to their medical records). The main nurse assigned to my father's case, readily provided me with a lot of detailed information from his medical records, initially, but then when I asked 2 follow-up questions the next day, the nurse told me that my middle sibling had since contacted the nursing staff, and told them that all medical information should only be given to my brother and they could not answer any more of my questions. I tried to follow up with voicemails and e-mails, with no response, from the nursing staff or my brother as to the cause of this action. I initially questioned the legality of this, and asked my mother if my brother had been given POA and she said, "No," in front of my brother, which prompted an extremely heated argument between my brother and I, in front of my mother, where my brother said I was a, "...mentally unstable lunatic, and that no one wanted me there, and that I should just go away...that my mother did not want me there helping out." This was a year ago, mid-June. Needless to say, I was traumatized, confused and horrified that this nasty argument took place in the presence of my mother. I then texted my brother that I apologized to my mother, and told her that my brother and I would never again fight in front of her, and I thanked him for everything he was doing for my parents. He texted back that he needed "a break" from any contact with me, including phone calls, e-mails and text messages. I have never been able to figure out what prompted this extreme reaction from my (now POA) sibling. After several months of no contact, we began to have brief text messages only in regards to the dates of visits with my parents, or he informed me when my mother moved out of my parent's townhome into an assisted living facility and gave me her new phone number. This continued until, all of a sudden, this past April, I was "invited" by my POA brother to a family gathering at my parent's facility for the weekend, but still with no med info.
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She had everything set up 20 years ago but he had it all changed to benefit himself. The police, my Senator & APS all told me I should get a lawyer but I just don’t have the money especially with the new DPOA stating he can use moms money.
He has completely broken her trust & gone against her longtime wishes.
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Jada824, I am VERY sorry about your situation with your DPOA sibling and your mom. It seems odd that a DPOA could barr contact - have you consulted an attorney on this matter?
Reading your post and your comments below, there is one key point which is unavoidable, and that is confidentiality. Your parents' medical records are strictly confidential, and without either their consent or that of their legal representative, *none* of the information should have been shared with you.
This is not a reflection on your efforts to understand their physical and mental health challenges and do your best to support them; it really is a cut-and-dried, black-and-white issue.
You seem very conscientious about really getting to grips in detail with what is going on, and I'm with you on that! :) I like exact information too. But sometimes ambiguity and uncertainty are just there in the territory and you have to live with them.
This shouldn't stop you being an excellent visitor and contributing to your parents' quality of life. Listen to your parents, use questions rather than statements, pretend you don't know anything about how they're feeling on a given day and let them guide the conversation.
If it's any consolation (see my avatar for how I feel about it!) I just started a new job and got my ears chewed off in the first week for "trying to solve everything." I have spent the time since then keeping my mouth zipped shut and turning purple, but I have learned that it is better to listen than to speak.
All the same, you have done nothing wrong, nothing to feel guilty about. It's unfortunate that this huge row blew up in front of your mother but I don't think anyone is to blame - feelings boiled over, as they do under such stress.
Start afresh, and focus on being a warm, positive presence for your parents; and maybe, as time goes on, a support to your brother that he will come to appreciate better.
Thank you so much for your empathetic and informational response! I can't tell you how much it helps to just to have some positive, supportive feedback from an objective person like yourself, who can look at the situation without all the emotional, family dynamics and drama!
Thank you for this suggestion - I have tried to do exactly as you have suggested, since being cutoff from medical information from the care facility staff about my parents (now both have been diagnosed with dementia). I have just tried to enjoy visiting with my parents when I am at their facility. I definitely do not need to control any information about my parent's medical care and treatment. I initially was maybe a little overenthusiastic with providing suggestions, but had good intentions of only trying to help, not be in control. At this point, I would just appreciate being informed if my parents have a dramatic decline in the stage of their disease, especially if that necessitates a change in how I need to interact with them, when visiting, such as, not bringing up certain past family events that my parents do not remember anymore or certain extended family members or friends that one or both of my parents don't remember any more, as to not embarrass my parents (I heard this can be a common issue with dementia patients).
I would not argue with the decisions made by the POA for health care, as the decisions are theirs to be made, and they were chosen to make them. I might gently say where and when if I differed, but I would be supportive and would recognize that the choices ultimately are theirs to make.
I would be thankful to them for taking on a very difficult job.
I am assuming, of course that this person is not a criminal bent on harm and cruelty to the parent. You haven't said that he or she is.
So sorry for your pain. I hope your parent is unaware of any warring between siblings over them. There is nothing so heartbreaking as someone old and weak being torn in the middle between the children they love.
I have been afraid of asking for information, since I have since been told by friends that it seems that the problem was me asking too many questions, asking for too much medical information, and giving too many suggestions as to my father's (the demential parent in memory care) care and treatment. Also, frankly, I have been traumatized by the nasty in-person heated argument my POA sibling and I had in front of my mother (see my response to GardenArtist), a year ago, last June. In fact, I have had trauma-like flashbacks of the incident over the past 16 months.
I initially backed WAY off in visiting my parents in frequency in the summer and fall of 2018 (I live 4 hrs away), and during that time, the trauma of the incident basically took its toll on my 15 year marriage, and my husband and I separated and are now in the middle of a divorce. I began gradually to call and go see my parents again, in winter, 2018, and winter-spring 2019, but the visits were very awkward and tense, as I didn't know what all of my parent's caregiving staff had been told about how to interact/not interact with me regarding my parents. Instead, I just concentrated on visiting with my parents, and tried to "...lay low and go with the flow." Things have gradually gotten less icy with my POA brother, but I have learned that he seems to need total control as to all care and treatment decisions as to my parents, and I have not dared to ask any questions regarding their condition, or make any suggestions.
It definitely has been a very painful, and confusing experience, with me feeling somewhat like the "blacksheep" sibling, and that I have somehow done something wrong, but no one whom I have spoken to about this experience seems to be able to provide an explanation as to the cause of my being cut off from medical information about my dementia parents (now both have dementia) from the care facility nursing staff.
This is a question based on relationships that are frequently addressed here.
Do some analysis of your relationship, ask yourself what caused it, sustained it, and what, if anything can be done to address it, modify it, and/or work around it?
It's unfortunate that siblings fall into these situations, and I know that some situations can't be corrected. But if not, perhaps you can address the underlying reasons why you're being cut out.
My POA sibling and I have always had a good relationship and have never had an argument (beyond childish spats in high school - he is 2 yrs older) before the phone argument that led to my being cut off from medical information about my both of my parents, actually, who are in different stages of dementia, from the nursing staff at their care facility. My being cut off came about 1 yr and 4 months ago, after my father had been admitted to memory care about 7 wks before at the beginning of April, 2018. At that time it was unclear as to which sibling had the healthcare POA - this brother (the middle of 3 siblings) told us (the other 2) that the POA document my parents drew up had my parents as POA for each other, than the POA went from oldest to youngest sibling (I am the youngest). My middle brother (now the POA sibling) was closest in proximity to my parents, and was the initial emergency contact for the retirement community staff, so he was initially involved in getting my father admitted to memory care. I am a teacher, and have summers off, so after the end of the school year, I began to become more involved in helping my parents with the transition (my mother living alone for the first time), and I began to ask a lot of questions of my, now POA sibling, as to the testing, diagnosis and treatment options presented to my parent (father) admitted to memory care. My sibling did not know the answer to many of my questions, so I began to do a lot of research on the disease on the internet and made questions to the nursing staff, when I went to visit my parents ( I live about 4 hours away). The nursing staff was initially very receptive and for the questions I asked about my father's history of diagnosis, treatment and prognosis of his dementia for which they did not have an answer, they promised to look the information up in my father's medical chart (my parents had signed a document, when they moved into the facility, that the nursing staff would have access to their medical records). The main nurse assigned to my father's case, readily provided me with a lot of detailed information from his medical records, initially, but then when I asked 2 follow-up questions the next day, the nurse told me that my middle sibling had since contacted the nursing staff, and told them that all medical information should only be given to my brother and they could not answer any more of my questions. I tried to follow up with voicemails and e-mails, with no response, from the nursing staff or my brother as to the cause of this action. I initially questioned the legality of this, and asked my mother if my brother had been given POA and she said, "No," in front of my brother, which prompted an extremely heated argument between my brother and I, in front of my mother, where my brother said I was a, "...mentally unstable lunatic, and that no one wanted me there, and that I should just go away...that my mother did not want me there helping out." This was a year ago, mid-June. Needless to say, I was traumatized, confused and horrified that this nasty argument took place in the presence of my mother. I then texted my brother that I apologized to my mother, and told her that my brother and I would never again fight in front of her, and I thanked him for everything he was doing for my parents. He texted back that he needed "a break" from any contact with me, including phone calls, e-mails and text messages. I have never been able to figure out what prompted this extreme reaction from my (now POA) sibling. After several months of no contact, we began to have brief text messages only in regards to the dates of visits with my parents, or he informed me when my mother moved out of my parent's townhome into an assisted living facility and gave me her new phone number. This continued until, all of a sudden, this past April, I was "invited" by my POA brother to a family gathering at my parent's facility for the weekend, but still with no med info.