Am I doing enough?

I personally think your mother has given up on life and that's why she's saying 'no' to everything. If she wants to continue living with you, she'll need to become a bit more compliant because you do not want to be an accessory to her demise, like she's insisting on. While she's entitled to live her remaining life as she sees fit, you too are entitled to see that her UTIs are minimized, and that she's being cared for properly. Meaning, mother, you need to agree to taking anti depressants, you need to agree to eating at least 1 meal a day with your family, to get my help with bathing 2x per week, with toileting, etc. It's not okay for her to turn herself into SUCH a burden that you'll be at wits end in no time and back & forth to the doctor for antibiotics! UTIs can easily turn into kidney infections and worse in the elderly who get them recurrently.

If she prefers to go to a nursing home, they will bathe her and medicate her there instead, upon doctors orders. Her choice.

That's what I'd do if were my mother. She doesn't have to become Suzy Socialite, but at the same time, she DOES have to be somewhat compliant and agreeable to living a life of minimal cleanliness and activity on YOUR terms. Your house, your rules.

Wishing you the best of luck laying down some boundaries & then sticking to them!

Dear Hannah16,

I feel your angst, you sound like a very good daughter who is willing to do ANYTHING to help her mama. I identify so much with you.
But ... here comes the but ... you are not helping her or yourself (or your family) by avoiding the care that your mom needs. Just because her answer is always 'no' doesn't mean the answer is NO.
YOU are the caregiver, YOU make the decisions. YOU are going to have to be (sorry to say) the bad guy here.
She doesn't want to bathe ... okay well she HAS to bathe (no questions, no compromises), so you get help to come in and bathe her. You'll be shocked by how compliant she will be with other people - caregivers who are used to dealing with elderly. They are amazing! My mom did a complete turn-around when I got help to go in and do what I could not do.
I honestly don't think we are equipped, as daughters, to know how to handle this. We are also learning. Don't be afraid of giving up some control to caregivers, or doctors, or experts. They have the training and the knowledge to help you through this difficult time. The longer you wait to take these steps the more difficult it will be, not just for you but for your mom! She needs the help, she needs to be told what to do and she is NOT going to listen to YOU. She will listen to strangers! And gradually she'll get to know them, and have at least one favourite, and she will find a way to cope. You cannot make her cope, has to be her decision. And they NEVER listen to us! You know I'm right!
I send you all my good vibes, please don't wait to reach out and get the help you (and your mother) need. There's NO WAY on earth you can do this by yourself.

What is she thinking? That's not a rhetorical question, I do mean what does she think. What does she think about, how does she see her situation, what if anything does she talk to you about, and what can you *get* her to talk about?

Change the subject from her and her lifestyle and health, and widen out the topics to - for example - your Dad, their life, current and past events. Not all at once! Just dig around a bit, conversationally, and see if you can get a glimpse of her point of view.

The thing is, yes, you can ethically let her continue like this. But it may be that there is no need for her to come to the end of the road just yet, and more time and research might give her a chance to find something she wants to do and something to look forward to once again. It's at least worth having a go :)

I want to second what Sunny just wrote.

For many of us, our loved one's cognitive decline looked like apathy, laziness "pity party" (my brother's words).

In your shoes, I would be figuring out the best way to get a thorough cognitive evaluation as soon as you can get an appointment .

I'm not talking about "who is the president and what is your address"? A real evaluation that assesses her thinking and reasoning skills

She’s entitled to choose her activities and treatment, or lack of them. But at the same time this is your home and she is an invited guest there. It’s not too much to expect a regular bath, and when the depression is bringing down the mood of everyone she needs to agree to the med for that. Have an honest talk with her and tell her these two things are conditions of her continuing to live in your home. And then follow through, handing her the med and watching her take it and overseeing the bath.

If she's having lots of toileting issues, like you describe in your post below in which she's soiling the bed, won't use commode, won't bath, etc., she's experiencing something. Even people at age 82 are more engaged, unless there's some major medical problem.

All of the lethargy is likely telling you something. I'd consider that it's not likely that she's being lazy, or uncooperative on purpose. If she could do better, she would. You say that she's pretty mentally okay, but, your description doesn't sound that way. Has she been evaluated for cognitive decline? I would insist on that with her doctor and be sure to let him know what you have been observing too. If he thinks she needs the medication for depression, it might something that you insist on, if she wants to continue to live with you. She may not be able to really make informed decisions about her healthcare.

There might also be some dementia, but, it's difficult to say in the early stage. What you describe is very similar to what I saw with my LO in the early stage. I didn't know what it was, but, it was depression due to cognitive decline. I didn't realize that a lot of the things she didn't want to do was due to fear, confusion, lack of energy, loss of memory, embarrassment, etc. Things were changing in her brain and it frightened her. She wasn't sure how to tell me. Later, it was found to be dementia.

I hope that you can find some answers. When my LO went on a med for anxiety and depression, it was big help. Her dementia continued, but, her mood was greatly improved.

Have you considered a Hospice evaluation? She (and you) may gain some peace from acknowledging the fact that she wants no treatment.

Read my reply to Lealonnie.

Your Mom may have lost the will to live. No anti-depressant is going to help that. It didn't my MIL. She did well with the death of her husband 20 years earlier. It was losing her house and freedom that did it. She was 91. After a UTI she went to rehab. Since her 3 sons all lived one to two days away. So she was being transferred from Fla to Ga (nearest son) to complete rehab. She was told after she completed rehab, she would need to make a decision which son to live with. She was a stubborn woman and passed a day before the transfer.

I would call Hospice and ask if they can evaluate Mom to see if she has lost the will to live. If so, then they can keep her comfortable.

To help with curbing the UTIs, you may want to try cranberry tablets and a probiotic. Lots of water. (may want to have Mom checked for dehydration. Causes depression and Dementia type symtoms) Keep wipes handy in the bathroom she uses.

She is Residing under your Roof. You need to Remind her of this. tell her sh eneeds a WEEKLY BATH so NO PIN WORMS or BED BUGS. Tell her if this Happens, They will Have her Leaving to ANOTHER FACILITY. You canno tmake her Taake the Depressed Pills but Can Grin dthem UP in her Food. As Far as making her Dpo things to Excerise, She is Old and thye will DO what they Please at tghis age. believ eme. Stubborn as a MULE.

Try telling her that all of her meds are vitamins. Also tell her that her Dr said that if she doesn’t take them to make her feel better, he will order her to go to a rehab, because she is causing herself self harm. This worked with my Mother. I don’t ask my Mom, I just say it’s time to do so and do. Daily prayer really helped me, as well.