CBD for dementia agitation? Thoughts?

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PerfumeGarden Asked April 2022

CBD for dementia agitation? Thoughts?

I'm kinda tired of the psych med game and upping the doses for difficult dementia behaviors. Today my pop had sundowning during mid-day, which isn't his usual time for those sort of stress waves. I gave him a half dose of his olanzapine, and will give him the other half at tonight's medication time. He would not stop doing the same repetitive movements, and kept throwing things (not at me, just around the room for no reason). I just gave him 40mg of CBD oil, which I take for stress and anxiety. It just calmed him down into a nap, which I will have to end in about 30 minutes for dinner and medication, but I'm curious what successes or failures people have had with CBD in elderly dementia patients. He specifically has vascular dementia. Thoughts?

Alzheimer's & Dementia Medication Management Sundowner's Syndrome

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score 1 · Answer 1

Concerning UTI's, we are giving my mom a cranberry capsule daily, and since then she has not had any UTI's. Supposedly the cranberry concentrate changes the ph in the bladder and bacteria can't live in that ph. It works great, without having to expose her to long term antibiotics.

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score 0 · Answer 2

PerfumeGarden: You should speak with your pop's physician for the okay on the CBD.

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I already did, his NP came, who reports to and from his primary provider---posted above.

(2)

score 1 · Answer 3

My husband has vascular dementia. I haven't tried cbd but trazadone has worked wonders for agitation and sleep.

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Do you feel like vascular dementia progresses quickly? Just curious, seems less common a dementia than some others

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score 0 · Answer 4

Just a comment here. I wanted to see what all the hype about CBD and tried 2 different kinds, supposedly really good ones, reputable companies, about a year or so ago, and then ago just a couple of months ago. Each one, I tried a few weeks. Never felt anything whatsoever; oh and it tasted nasty. OTOH, I've heard lots of people and some patients in the past who swore by it, and said the oil was the only thing that helped her pain ( feet, I think it was). So, I have an open mind about it. But luckily I don't need it for anything which is good since I felt no effects :)

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score 1 · Answer 5

I spoke to the NP who came by about using CBD and she had no issue with it interacting with any medications, which is great.

Its an interesting conversation regarding the FDA and studies and such. I am pro-Western medicine and not a woo woo person, however, pharmaceutical companies tend to flourish when 1. A medication treats symptoms, not the root cause of a health problem and 2. When they are able to deter individuals from preventative treatments or off-label uses/alternative products or medicine, it’s profitable. A new medication that hasn’t passed the patent expiration yet is their bread and butter. They look out for their own interests and there are lobbyists at the FDA. Also, from a friend in epidemiology working at a there are way more data error cover-ups at institutions we would prefer to have confidence in. Doctors are encouraged by reps. Look at the opioid crisis and the Sacklers, MD doctors recklessly prescribed OxyContin and now we have a generational opioid crisis in America. Idk, food for thought about putting blind faith in the medical industry. 🤷🏼‍♀️

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Fact: "Based on data for 63 therapeutic agents developed by 47 companies between 2009 and 2018, the median research and development investment required to bring a new drug to market was estimated to be $985 million, and the mean was estimated to be $1.34 billion."

(source: https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jama/article-abstract/2762311)

Fact: Drug patents last 20 years but it is a more complex calculation than that, since this may include the years before it achieved FDA approval and could be sold (if ever). In most cases it is more like 10 years.

So, pharma companies have about 10 years to recoup the 1.34 billion dollars it cost for a single drug that eventually gets approved (and also make a profit since they're not a charity). So, yes: it literally is their bread-and-butter, and rightfully so.

- "Cooked" data will eventually be found out, either through the inefficacy of the drug or through problems it may cause (like reactions/death). If your epidemiologist friend is aware of cover-ups then s/he should be whistleblowing. Are they?

Also, data on each drug continues to be collected after it hits the open market. This is why we occassionally will read about how "a recent study indicated that XX drug is not effective against XYZ illness as claimed".

- The Joint Commission on the Accreditation of Healthcare Organizations decided that "Pain" was the 5th medical vital sign:

"In 2001, as part of a national effort to address the widespread problem of underassessment and undertreatment of pain, The Joint Commission (formerly The Joint Commission on the Accreditation of Healthcare Organizations or JCAHO) introduced standards for organizations to improve their care for patients with pain. For over a decade, experts had called for better assessment and more aggressive treatment, including the use of opioids. Many doctors were afraid to prescribe opioids despite a widely cited article suggesting that addiction was rare when opioids were used for short-term pain. Education, guidelines, and advocacy had not changed practice, and leaders called for stronger methods to address the problem. The standards were based on the available evidence and the strong consensus opinions of experts in the field."

Source: https://www.jointcommission.org/-/media/tjc/documents/resources/pain-management/pain_std_history_web_version_05122017pdf.pdf?db=web&hash=E7D12A5C3BE9DF031F3D8FE0D8509580&hash=E7D12A5C3BE9DF031F3D8FE0D8509580

The doctors were acting on the recommendation/pressure from this non-profit accredidation/certification organization. The pharmas were acting on the increase in demand, and victims are still suffering from this nightmare.

(1)

score 0 · Answer 6

I have used the CBD sports cream on My chest for bronchitis this winter from Happy Buddha hemp and it really helped and My sister used it for sore Back Pain and it helped .

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score 4 · Answer 7

We have been giving my mom CBD oil for the last 2 years around 4pm to help her with sundowning. It has worked great on her. One of the best things we have given her. I highly recommend it.

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Good to know! I'm just starting my mom on CBD gummies to help with her sleeping. Don't know any results yet but am hopeful.

(2)

score 4 · Answer 8

My H also has vascular dementia (=plus Parkinson's). Recently, his new neurologist suggested CBD, starting with the lowest dose (10 mg). I give it at 3pm (a gel-cap) along with his anti-anxiety med mertazipine (which I just started giving him in the afternoon in addition to bedtime). I'm not sure which med change is working but I have noticed a difference: calmer, not as hyper, over the past 2 weeks. I may try CBD too - maybe it will help me be calmer, not as stressed! As the pharmacy tech said when I asked about dosage, she said start low and increase - until you find your "Happy Place." I could use a "Happy Place" - caregiving isn't it.

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score 4 · Answer 9

Pharmacists in medical marijuana dispensaries are very educated.
I needed something for adhesive arachnoiditis and the pharmacist recommended a Hybridol cannabis oil. (Rice grain dose, squeezed into empty gel capsule they provide)
It ended my stinging nerve damage.
It was miraculous and still works to this day.
I’m also in a better mood.
Don’t pass this opportunity by due to a few uneducated in this area.
Curaleaf carry’s CBD products with every “route” available.
They would be able to assist you and it’s FREE information, if your state has it.
Good luck.

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I'm glad you got relief, just remember that if you ever have to take an actual prescription drug, you need to inform your MD of what you're taking before adding in anything else. The doc may have to contact a pharmacist, but the doc needs to stay in the loop. Talking to the pharmacist and not the MD first, keeps the MD out of the loop.

(2)

score 2 · Answer 10

Hey! Why not? Stick with ingestables and adjust dosages as needed depending on effects.

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score 5 · Answer 11

Some of my dementia clients are initially very happy with CBD products but their enthusiasm dwindles after about a month. If your state has a medical Marijuana program that seems to work a lot better. Don't get the smoking ki d or the ones that turn to vapor as those will harm their lungs. They have a variety of elixers that you just put a few drops under your tongue. ALWAYS start off as low as possible with dementia patients for ANY mood stabilizer though as their brains don't always react the same.

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score 2 · Answer 12

Please check with your pharmacist to make sure CBD doesn't negatively interact with his other medications. His pharmacist should also be able to give you a good idea of dosage and schedule.

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score 2 · Answer 13

I feel you . I try to be happy and there are instances that my mom is smiling and happy and laughs and then She turns into a monster later on in the day accusing me of taking her stuff and she doesn’t want to be left alone . I can’t be home , I work and while it’s not everyday , I try leaving stuff for her to do so she is kept busy until I get home . I leave her lunch as well . It’s exhausting as I run around before I leave to get her to take her pills and eat her breakfast and fill her water bottle so I know she has all she needs until I get back . Drained to the max !

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score 1 · Answer 14

I
think it’s a great idea but I would only do CBD it can be a heavy medication . Happy Buddha Hemp has a 2400 strength give a dropper full after lunch they are based in Colorado and will send you a sample . The gummies from FIVE CBD are very good and they have sales all the time and special - there are 50 mg CBD with 2 THC or 25 mg CBD and 5 THC - if the OCD behavior continues past 2 pm give him a couple 50 mg CBD that is very calming and takes awhile to get into the system . If it’s for sleep give 1 or 2 - 25 mg after dinner - they are strong . I always try things on my self . I wouldn’t mix them with pharmaceuticals . FIVE is located in Laguna and are having a 42% off sale for 420 - buy yourself some . They are good quality .

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It is very important that the OP confer with the doctor BEFORE giving any other OTC medication or supplement, as supplements can also interact with any current medication their LO is taking.

(0)

score 2 · Answer 15

You may want to check him for a UTI, which can cause mental status changes and frequently no other symptoms in elderly patients. I regularly (every 3 weeks or so) check my 94 year old mother for a UTI with the home UTI test strips available at Walgreens or CVS, etc., and I have discovered 2 infections in the last 2 years that I would not have known about. Both of them were associated with crazy mental symptoms at odd times of the day. She went back to baseline after treatment with antibiotics. Just a thought.

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Oh yeah, we’ve had UTIs before, and this sundowning now is NOTHING compared to him with a UTI. He tried to build a bed barricade and swung at a family member. Took two firefighters to get him calm enough in the jump chair to the ER. it was WILD

(1)

score 5 · Answer 16

My mom also has vascular dementia. While CBD oil,etc. may seem to work, mom's doctor said it can interact with medications she's already taking, and not in a good way. Please be upfront with her doctor to he sure this won't be the case with your mom.

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score 2 · Answer 17

I know this is not the answer you are looking for but please do what makes life easier for yourself I’m tired of all the stress that is heaped upon me regarding my mum and feel like running a mile and guess you feel the same it’s a tedious depressing task having to care for them isn’t it? Good luck x

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score 2 · Answer 18

My dad is in memory care . They were bombarding him with all sorts of med including antipsychotics and oxy. ( it is totally illegal to use chemical restraints ) patients have rights and you as their POA have the right to refuse to have your parent snowed! That said his behaviors were becoming more of a threat to the staff - my friend who is a PA-C suggested cbd oil.it’s worked amazingly well . One tip: we started slow and titrated up to avoid falls and we got it from a source that she recommended to insure purity
good luck !

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In one's body CBD in processed just like any other chemical, so what's the diff? Also, what legitimate governing body oversees (and gives consequences) for the "purity" of the CBD? If it's not the FDA, then that organization has no real teeth. Plus, there's also other things to worry about with every pill: potency; consistency; efficacy; and integrity. The FDA monitors and keeps accountable all pharma companies when it comes to these criteria for all of their products.

(2)

score 1 · Answer 19

Yah, he is prescribed Olanzapine...when he's sundowning he probably requires a blow dart to the neck at this point. I'm even considering giving him some indica weed gummies, I have medical card access. I know it knocks me out when I'm struggling to sleep (not that I get the privilege of deep sleep with still working out his night time routine post-respite care.

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score 3 · Answer 20

There are no medications specifically made for agitation in dementia. Olanzapine is an anti-psychotic used for treating schizophrenia and psychosis in general. It does not benefit dementia at all, but knocks out the patients and that is why is used. In reality, you can try anything, tranquilizers, hypnotics, sedatives, barbiturates, morphine or whatever is available. Some work, some don't work and some stop working over time. Try whatever your hands can get.

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score 1 · Answer 21

Geaton777---

Bright light helps so much, it's wild. He is not activity oriented (yet), really hard to get him to be interested in anything besides talking, he talked nonstop when he didn't have dementia haha, ex barfly, very social by nature. Liked to garden, may try that when the cold weather finally knocks it off.

I think CBD is probably worth a trial but also curious about stigma telling his doctor tomorrow.

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I wouldn’t worry about stigma at all. They prob get asked this question multiple times a day.

(4)

score 2 · Answer 22

What other strategies have you tried? For sundowning it is suggested that you start turning on bright lights where your LO is hanging out and leaving them on until it's closer to his bedtime; also have you tried to engage him in a "purposeful" activity slightly before he usually starts in, like sorting screws from nails, pair screws and nuts, sorting & pairing a large pile of colorful socks, chopping veggies for dinner (or a future meal), sorting a large quantity of plastic utensils, etc. This keeps them occupied for (hopefully) a while and burns mental energy so they may sleep better at night (as is the case for my 100-yr old aunt with mod/adv dementia). If your pop has memory impairment and he cooperates with these activities, you can repeat them daily since he won't remember. My aunt folds a large pile of kitchen towels several times a day. Sleeps like a baby every night. Not a perfect solution and maybe it'll work for your LO.

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score 0 · Answer 23

my Friends mom look it and it seemed to help. Seemed, because as 60 Minutes pointed out, most of the cbd products aren’t near the potency of the cbd anti epileptic epilex, the only drug that the fda does consider effective.

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CBD for dementia agitation? Thoughts?

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