My MIL is in a nursing home and my husband wants to bring her home with all the appropriate support for her. However, the NH says no?
The NH says that his sister signed over POA to them but she cannot remember doing this. Surely a loving family has the right to look after their own. The NH charge £5000 a month for 4 years so we think that they want the money more than his Mum.
Don't bring the cost into this if you are sincerely motivated only by a desire to give your MIL the best possible quality of life. Speaking about the money raises suspicions about your husband's motivation and the kindf of care she will recieve at home. But you are right to assess the nursing home's motive as financial. It would be different if they had said the woman has been happy, doing well, improving and receiving care that can only be provided in a NH, if there is such a thing.
Major: The nursing home must prove to you and the sister that she granted them POA. They must produce the document she signed and if notarization was required, the contact information for the notary public. Don't let them tell you if notarization was required. Find out from the government.
If a notary was involved you can ask the notary who served to confirm and prove your sister's signature. They can also show when and possibly where the signing took place. If the NH cannot show you the signed, notarized (if applicable) POA, you have options regarding whether and to whom to report them for lying and for controlling an elder's healthcare and living place by fraud.
If the sister did sign over POA to them, find out if she can revoke the action in the relevant jurisdiction. Ignore what the NH says. Get an authoritative answer.
Personally, I support efforts to care for loved ones in their homes whenever that is what they want. If they can't express a choice, I'd advocate for excellent home care over excellent NH care.
Two issues here. Both major. 1. Which is the legal POA? 2. Sufficient level of care.
If Sister is POA why would your DH take over the hands-on? To do that, HE needs to be POA, to be able to legally arrange & run his own Nursing-Home-For-One.
When you say 'appropriate support' I guess he means round the clock Care Aide staff + visiting Doctor, Nurse, Podiatrist, Physio etc, right? Will he be admin/accountant/finance? What will your role be?
Or..
Is this your Husband feeling some sort of 'guilt' ie I WISH I could just bundle Mother up & bring her home to look after myself 😥🤔
A good home care plan can work well - if practical, well managed & legal. But it is a very different beast to the wishful thinking of sadness & grief. I don't mean to belittle his plan.. just asking the WHY behind it..
Faith13, what health issues does your husband's Mom have? What was the reason that she was first placed in a nursing home? If your husband brings his Mom home [I assume to your home], will it be set up the same as a nursing home? Will there be enough family members to help with the 24 hour care?
Why I ask those questions, many do not realize all that is required is be around the clock caregiver. You may have family members who are willing to help now, but don't be surprised if they start to fade away realizing how exhausting this can be. And hiring outside help would cost more than the original nursing home.
Of course they want the money more that his mother. Nursing home DO NOT care about their residents. It's all about the money and profits. If your MIL is an easy (doesn't complain, doesn't need much care, etc...) they don't want to lose residents like that because they get the same money for an easy one as they get for a hard-to-handle resident. With all respect to your family, if your husband's sister is an idiot. Who forgets if whether or not they gave over a POA? I see that you're paying the nursing home in pounds, so I'm assuming you are in the United Kingdom. I don't know what the rules are about POA or conservatorship/guardianship, or how Wills are executed where you are. In the United States, at least in my state if someone wants to change a POA that has to be done legally either by a lawyer, a judge, or through the probate court. The same if someone wants to change or give up executorship of their Will too. You may be able to petition the court for conservatorship and have it appointed to you. It's likely that you would win. I can't see how any judge would refuse it if you can provide the level of care she has to have. You'd be saving your national health service a fortune too by taking her our of the NH.
I will assume your from England. In the US your sister would not be able to turn over a POA. Only the person who assigned her can revolk it and assign another. NHs can go for guardianship through the State. That overrides a POA but guardianship can be contested
I would first find out if in England POAs can be transferred without the principle being involved. If not, then I would ask to see the proof that POA was turned over to the NH. If they will not show you or sister the paperwork, you may need to get a Lawyer involved.
Ask to see the NOTARIZED POA paperwork. If your sister can't recall signing one and having it notarized; and doesn't have the original notarized copy of the POA; then the NH should have a notarized copy. If so, I'm sure they are happy to provide it. The only other explanation might be that it was part of the paperwork signed by your sister when your MIL was admitted. Ask to see the entire packet. I don't know the law in other countries; but in the USA, the NH would have to have this POA notarized in order for it to be legal and binding. As an aside: the cost you mention for NH care (~$6000/month USD) is not out of line for a nursing home here at all. Good luck!
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Major: The nursing home must prove to you and the sister that she granted them POA. They must produce the document she signed and if notarization was required, the contact information for the notary public. Don't let them tell you if notarization was required. Find out from the government.
If a notary was involved you can ask the notary who served to confirm and prove your sister's signature. They can also show when and possibly where the signing took place. If the NH cannot show you the signed, notarized (if applicable) POA, you have options regarding whether and to whom to report them for lying and for controlling an elder's healthcare and living place by fraud.
If the sister did sign over POA to them, find out if she can revoke the action in the relevant jurisdiction. Ignore what the NH says. Get an authoritative answer.
Personally, I support efforts to care for loved ones in their homes whenever that is what they want. If they can't express a choice, I'd advocate for excellent home care over excellent NH care.
1. Which is the legal POA?
2. Sufficient level of care.
If Sister is POA why would your DH take over the hands-on? To do that, HE needs to be POA, to be able to legally arrange & run his own Nursing-Home-For-One.
When you say 'appropriate support' I guess he means round the clock Care Aide staff + visiting Doctor, Nurse, Podiatrist, Physio etc, right? Will he be admin/accountant/finance? What will your role be?
Or..
Is this your Husband feeling some sort of 'guilt' ie I WISH I could just bundle Mother up & bring her home to look after myself 😥🤔
A good home care plan can work well - if practical, well managed & legal. But it is a very different beast to the wishful thinking of sadness & grief. I don't mean to belittle his plan.. just asking the WHY behind it..
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Why I ask those questions, many do not realize all that is required is be around the clock caregiver. You may have family members who are willing to help now, but don't be surprised if they start to fade away realizing how exhausting this can be. And hiring outside help would cost more than the original nursing home.
Are you then going to be expected to be one of the (or the only?) caregivers?
If your MIL is an easy (doesn't complain, doesn't need much care, etc...) they don't want to lose residents like that because they get the same money for an easy one as they get for a hard-to-handle resident.
With all respect to your family, if your husband's sister is an idiot. Who forgets if whether or not they gave over a POA? I see that you're paying the nursing home in pounds, so I'm assuming you are in the United Kingdom. I don't know what the rules are about POA or conservatorship/guardianship, or how Wills are executed where you are. In the United States, at least in my state if someone wants to change a POA that has to be done legally either by a lawyer, a judge, or through the probate court. The same if someone wants to change or give up executorship of their Will too.
You may be able to petition the court for conservatorship and have it appointed to you. It's likely that you would win. I can't see how any judge would refuse it if you can provide the level of care she has to have. You'd be saving your national health service a fortune too by taking her our of the NH.
I would first find out if in England POAs can be transferred without the principle being involved. If not, then I would ask to see the proof that POA was turned over to the NH. If they will not show you or sister the paperwork, you may need to get a Lawyer involved.
If your sister can't recall signing one and having it notarized; and doesn't have the original notarized copy of the POA; then the NH should have a notarized copy. If so, I'm sure they are happy to provide it.
The only other explanation might be that it was part of the paperwork signed by your sister when your MIL was admitted. Ask to see the entire packet. I don't know the law in other countries; but in the USA, the NH would have to have this POA notarized in order for it to be legal and binding.
As an aside: the cost you mention for NH care (~$6000/month USD) is not out of line for a nursing home here at all.
Good luck!