Dad makes frequent trips to bank, taking out large amounts of money. What can I do?

Am dealing with the same issue with my father in law. Found out after they lost everything to hurricane Harvey that He has been giving his money away to a guy that was "helping them around the house". The banks are all aware of what is going on so now he can only get cash by going in the bank. I only keep so much in his acct at a time. And I pay his bills online because he doesn't remember to pay them. He also had a neighbor that stole his check book. Dementia is a terrible disease and people that take advantage of the elderly just make me sick.

Do you do online banking?

It seems to me that if YOU are on the account, you can do any d@mn thing you want!

Rant over. So, take dad to an elder care attorney (on dad's funds). Explain what is happening and have the lawyer explain to dad that smart older people get scammed all the time and that it is in dad's best interest to have someone else (you) look after his money.

Examine your POA and see what its terms are.  Was it prepared by a lawyer?  Does it require incapacity?

Send a letter, return receipt to dad's doctor and describe what is happening.  Take dad in for his next appointment and discuss this with the doc and dad. 

And let us know what happens; we learn from each other here!

How is the account titled? How is he withdrawing cash, via ATM or via check?

Others may have better ideas, but I would take my POA papers into the bank and ask for their advice. Many banks have their own POS forms that they want completed, so you may need to bring dad in to complete those.

I would make it clear to the bank that you are concerned that dad is being scammed by someone or that YOU, because you have access to the account, will be accused of having taken the monies.

What is he doing with the funds he withdraws? Is he spending them, or saving them at home?

Please understand that if your father is taking out large or small sums of cash from his bank and there is no supporting evidence of where the money went, if he needs Medicaid for long term care it may be denied. Large sums of cash withdrawn without explanation is a red flag for gifting with state run Medicaid and Medicaid can refuse to pay for care.

This post brings up other concerns for me. Dad has dementia. Dad is still driving. That to me might be a bigger risk than Dad's financial behavior. Is he really still safe to drive? An accident could wipe him out financially, not to mention the personal damage to himself and others.

And also, this man has been very frugal for many years, and apparently now wants the pleasure of having money available. I think I might feel that way too, if I had a fatal disease. Of course he cannot use all his money up now because he will need it to last for however long he has. But instead of focusing only on how to prevent his withdrawals, I think I'd try to help him feel rich and entitled to have nice things/money in a home safe/money to give as gifts -- whatever "reward" he wants for all those frugal years, but within reason considering his long-term needs. This might take a lot of effort and time on your part (or someone close to him.) Maybe there is a weekly trip to the bank to withdraw a predetermined amount, and then a trip to spend some -- a nice meal out, a new bathrobe, a movie, etc., and then a return home to put the rest of the money in the safe. Does he want a more extravagant item? He could supplement his weekly withdrawal with some money from the home bank, and get a new TV.

Maybe there are more creative ways to let him have the benefit of having money without that much effort on the part of someone else. My suggested weekly bank outing may not fit Dad's situation. But the goal -- letting Dad have the pleasure of some "frivolous" spending after so many years of being frugal -- seems to me very valid.

How old is Dad, btw?

Dear talknow,

Freqflyer and Barb have excellent suggestions. I would start with talking to the bank about limiting the daily withdrawal. I know a daily limit can be set in place by the customer to limit fraud.

I would try and talk to your dad and see if you can get to the bottom of why he feels he needs to withdraw this money. Are his meds affecting his behaviour? I wonder if the meds are causing new and unknown side effects?

Thank you for all of your suggestions/comments. We do not know where the money has gone, can't get an answer from dad - he's either lying, confused or just doesn't want to tell us. After talking to him and the bank, we put his money into another account and he will receive an allowance. We are also discussing moving him to a senior home where he will have people to talk to and people to keep an eye on him as well as drive him to stores, etc. Thanks again for all of your help. Happy Holidays.

I had POA for both of my parents, but ended up having to get Legal Guardianship through the courts. Their caregiver at the time was taking my Dad to the bank to take out a total of $2,000.00 a month in cash. By the time I stepped in, over $25,000.00 had been taken. She is now going to trial for exploitation of the elderly.
Legal Guardianship is the best way to get everything under control financially. I had the banks change the address on the accounts and the accounts had to have specific wording on them. I also moved all of the money to a new bank so my parents wouldn't have access to the money. Both of my parents have Alzheimer's.

I am dealing with a parallel issue. I live in TX (middle child), Mom is back home in AZ. My older sister "lives" with Mom (my Uncle and I call it she just sleeps there) and professes to be the 24/7 caregiver for Mom/Step-Father.
Mom, my Uncle and me all worked on Mom's legal papers (which have "disappeared" this past December while Mom was in the hospital). I had Med POA and would be the dicision maker if one would need to pull the plug (yes, the living will has disappeared). Mom wanted me to take care of everything....her words...I know I can trust you to take care of me and everything after I'm gone.

I made a 'surprise' trip home this past January as Mom has dementia and things just didn't sound right during her hospital stay in December (my sister convinced her that I was the reason she had to stay in the hospital pretty much the month of December).

l called and told my Step-Father I was in town and would see them the next day AFTER MY SISTER WENT TO WORK (night shift). I arrived at the appointed time, NO ONE WAS HOME!! The neighbor approached me like...who are you and what are you doing? I asked him where Mom was...answer...your Mom was taken to the hospital this morning around 6:00. No call or text from my sister and this was around 2:00 in the afternoon. Needless to say, my sister was extremely surprised and 'attitude' changed right there on the spot.

Mom had asked my Step-Father a few days later to bring the bills to her so she could pay them. I asked her where they were so I could get them ready most important first etc. I had to go through 3 baskets of bills which also contained past due bills. Mom always had me take care of their money issues when we still lived in AZ while they were on vacation etc. Both Mom/I are 30+ yrs each bankers, so I knew what to do about the past due bills.

My sister told me that she always goes over the bills with Mom, she makes the checks out and Mom signs them. I pulled out the easiest past due so as to explain why this bill was behind. Sister became EXTREMELY UPSET with me for having gone through the bills in the first place. Sister stressed that she personally "walked" the payment into the creditor's office. Now comes the basic math regarding the bill, she was infactic that this creditor had to be wrong (1st clue). I told her that I know what to do and had verified the past due etc. This then became a very heated debate and then she brought in Mom's Will is missing and she is going to have Mom redo the Will because the State will take every thing from "us". Don't mess with a banker that had to deal with these type of issues. The more she talked the more I listened and started to get a clearer picture of what is going on.

All of that made me start looking into lawyers who deal with Estate Law. I have a membership with JustAnwer.com (many complain about this company). I always refer my questions regarding my understanding of AZ Law once I have read through the Law and Statutes and provide him with that so he is able to research. This attorney has been a great source of knowledge.

Ok, Google your State's Law regarding Elderly Finance Abuse. Most likely you will get a link for a printable PDF. AMAZING WHAT YOU WILL FIND HERE. You should also get a PDF printout regarding proper/accepted Notary Laws for your State also. I have found 2 fraudulant actions by my sister so far.

1. If you are on as a joint owner of the account, you can do what you need to do with the money i.e. have the bank note that your Father cannot withdraw without your knowledge, hence you give the ok or not.
2. If you have Power of Attorney to act for your Father financially, the bank will need this on file. It must contain all of your duties allowed financially including withdrawing money or not. There will be a Banker who knows the ins-outs of this.
3. With a proper POA, you can have the account 'flagged' as 'protected'. This means that the bank will review each transation daily, including ATM withdrawals and watch for suspicious transactions i.e. ATM withdrawals late at night when you know he should be home.
4. You have the right to file an investigation of concern for possible money fraud. Anyone can file this investigation with the bank. Be prepared to answer questions regarding your Father's health, living alone, who does he have most contact with etc.
YOU DO NOT HAVE TO PROVIDE YOUR NAME FOR THIS REPORT!!! IF THE BANK REFUSES BECAUSE YOU DON'T WANT YOU NAME ON THE REPORT, THEY ARE IN VIOLATION OF 31 U.S.C. sec 5318 (g) (3) THIS IS A FEDERAL LAW WHICH OVER RIDES STATE.
5. An investigation # will be assigned (you will not have access to that). The investigation department will go through the majority of his transactions to see if there is a pattern. If things do not look kosher, they MUST inform Adult Protection AND Law Enforcement. YOU will receive notifiaction from the bank should this become necessary. Only the bank personnel you spoke with will have contact with you.

If someone in the family suspects that you have filed, it is your RIGHT to LIE about it. You are not under any obligation to tell anyone that you did file the report.

I did this just last night because things just were not feeling right after almost a year now. That gut feeling has just taken over and I can't stop researching.

Yes, I felt guilty about doing this, but I have to protect my Mother. Always have and always will, especially when one has siblings that, shall we say, have a colorful past.

****I have Mom's Will and my sister can make Mom redo it, but it won't hold up in Court because of the AZ Law regarding changes to a Will****

I also want to thank Aging Care for bringing things to light which have also given the gumption to research/talk with an attorney (even though he's on line, but I can speak directly with him on the phone if need be).

Good Luck to you and please, take a deep breath, pray and God is telling you something or you wouldn't have this on your mind.