My very close friend is 71 and has always been a super private and modest person. She was married for years and has two grown sons and 5 grandkids. She also has had a lot of issues “down there” over the years and an injury from childbirth. I’m 33, and over the last 20 years, her and I have become very close. Like Mom/daughter basically. It took her years to even get to this point but she is more open and comfortable with me, than basically anyone else, she has always had an overactive bladder that’s gotten worse after menopause. she has to pee ALL the time and when she has to go, she doesn’t always get a lot of warning. She also gets severe pain if she holds it too long that can result in some embarrassing situations. Together, we’ve learned how to make things like shopping trips and days out more comfortable for her. But that involves some practical help from myself and it’s not something she wants everyone to know about. Some of her symptoms are things she would rather keep private. .Anyways, she recently had knee surgery and had a couple traumatic experiences when it came to needing to use the washroom (urgently) and people either not understanding or just not being available, so she was forced to ask her son for help getting to the washroom and getting her pants down and then back up ect. Which resulted in her calling me afterwards, hyperventilating and in tears because she felt so humiliated. Her son didn’t know she wore bladder pads and she had a tiny bit of discharge on them as well so when he helped her pull down her pants, he saw something she didn’t ever want him (or anyone really), to see. She has another procedure coming up in a few weeks that will require help again, only this time, she might also need help with wiping herself, changing her pad and possibly even in the shower. She has asked me if I would stay with her for a few days so she doesn’t have to stress about this. About needing to get to the bathroom and no one being available, or needing help with wiping or changing her pad ect. Or God forbid if she has an accident,,helping her into the shower to get cleaned up. Her sons don’t like this idea and want to be the ones to care for her but she really isn’t comfortable with that. She is so afraid of upsetting them (that’s just her over all people pleaser personality). But right now, she’s just really struggling. I just don’t think they understand WHY she wants another female to help her with these things who isn’t related to her, when they are available. They also don’t understand the extremely close bond we have (she held one of my legs and watched me give birth). Because of our age agap friendship. and the fact that guys just generally don’t help eachother with stuff like this, especially outside of family. They think it’s just so so weird. .How can we get them to understand her need for privacy while also not offending them? They feel like because they helped care for their dad till the end, their Mom should be okay and want that same level of support and care as well. ***She also prefers when I take her to her appointments, simply because she doesn’t have to worry about needing help getting to a bathroom. If she needs a hand, I’m there. Plus I NEVER make her wait because I know how bad her urgency and pain can get if she has to wait…. Sometimes other people ask her if she can just “hold on cause we will be home in 20 mins” or “okay Mom,, I’ll come by in 10 mid and help you” and then she is stuck gritting her teeth and crossing her legs. Trying so hard to hold on and ends up embarrassed anyways. .How can we get them to understand this isn’t about choosing me over them. It’s about HER comfort, HER needs and HER fear of upsetting people, making her end up in terrible positions.
It sounds to me that there is more going on here than just her sons being "offended" that mom wants a female caregiver to help her with personal hygiene things. You mentioned there was some jealousy previously, but now the sons seem to be over it... are you absolutely sure about that?
I agree with CWillie, take steps to protect yourself from accusations of self-interest, especially if mom has some financial means. I know it sucks to have to consider that, especially when you are trying to be helpful, but unfortunately that's where we are in this world. I also agree that this is your friend's battle to have with her sons, and the time has come for her to be rather blunt with them about her issues. Either way, she is going to have to deal with some discomfort, and that also sucks, but sometimes you have to play the hand you're dealt. Maybe she should just be upfront with them about the entire situation that brought her to this point in her life; then maybe they'll finally "get it". But if she insists on keeping these things a secret, they can't be held responsible for their seeming lack of understanding.
Admins, can you overview this post for placement or removal.
Nurse, welcome to Forum. You've given us a long, quite oddly detailed description of private hygienic your "friend" is dealing with.
However, you seems to have no questions for us.
I find it unusual that a 71 y/o female is having such great difficulty getting into and out of her undergarments.
However, I hesitate to ask more questions here, lest I receive more answers.
I hope you'll give your friend the AgingCare Forum information.
I feel I may understand her problems better were she, herself, to write us.
I will meanwhile wish your friend best of luck. She has a medical team to help her; and goodness knows that the issues of frequency and urgency are not unusual in our aging population.
Best of luck.
PS - it might be wise to explore ways to protect yourself from accusations of undue influence
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When she needs to go to an appointment, she knows she will likely need at least 1-2 bathroom visits and if it becomes really urgent or she doesn’t quite make it in time, it’s SO much more comfortable for her to have a female she’s comfortable with, be there with her. Also if it’s a visit to her Urogynacologist, or urologist or even her endocrinologist, she doesn't want to answer private/personal questions in front of her sons. With me, it’s okay. We talk about that stuff all the time anyways….. when it’s JUST the two of us and she’s sure no one else is around,
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its more so an issue with her asking me to find her a female doctor and go with her, and her sons don’t understand why she doesn’t just ask them. It’s because of everything else that goes along with taking her to an appointment. And even with her hip surgeries, it involved helping her remove her pants, where it becomes obvious to the person helping, that she’s wearing a bladder pad or sometimes even a diaper and that’s just NOT knowledge she wants the world to know. Also sometimes, she leaks more than others and her pad might already be full by the time they get to the appointment. Especially if she just laughed or walked quite a ways. I can quickly and discreetly assess the situation and keep her covered until I can help her get cleaned up. And she doesn’t need to stress. Because she knows I’ll make sure she’s taken care of. I’m also a nurse. So there is a level of comfort there as well, even with the most intimate help.
Basically, it’s a million little reasons why she wants me to Take her to appointments so she doesn’t end up in an embarrassing situation with one of her middle aged sons. But, the boys helped to care for their dad a LOT the last year or so of his life, I feel like they think she feels they won’t do a good job with her. And that’s not it at all. It’s her trauma, her modesty and her own preferences. It’s largely impart to the fact, they just aren’t female lol
I can understand the close relationship. Many women this age have bladder issues. Some will even opt for bladder surgery. It's just part of the aging process especially after menopause and the bladder drops slightly.
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Her and I have a ton of non verbal cues for things so when we are out in public or around other people, she can get my attention or tell me things without having to announce her needs publicly. And there’s just a deep level of comfort between the two of us. Her sons do NOT get it. They struggled with our relationship years ago (especially when I was like 17/18/19) but had gotten a lot better with it over the years. It’s just been the last couple of years as she’s needed more “hands on” help, that she’s been turning to me more and the boys are frustrated.
they always new she talked to me about stuff she didn’t share with other people, but I don’t think they have any idea the things she’s been through and WHY she needs understanding and compassion in this area. She was severely traumatized during the birth of her youngest son. Physically and emotionally. She has PTSD but no one believes me. And 50 years ago, we did NOT understand how those kinds of things affected a woman for the rest of her life. Emotional trauma and her physical issues are a direct result of provider negligence and male obs and outdated systems, not respecting a woman and her knowledge of her OWN body…. When a woman says the baby is coming and she HAS to push, you don’t tell her “just hold on, the Dr is on his way, just wait”. And being young, scared and alone in the delivery room, she assumed the doctors and nurses were telling her the right things. Always being taught to listen to and respect the Doctors, she went against what her OWN body was telling her to do, and ended up in a lot of pain. So when her sons try to micromanage her care, that can also be very triggering.
Her kids love her very much, they just don’t understand (and to be fair, it’s never been explained to them) why she has the issues she does. Emotionally, mentally and physically. And why she just wants someone with her, she doesn’t have to explain things to. Someone who just gets it. And someone who loves her so much, I’d do anything to protect her privacy and dignity. But because I’m not related to her, the boys think a family member is still a better choice.
They don’t know that their Mom has PTSD and severe emotional and physical gynaecological trauma. No one does. It’s not something she ever talked about with anyone before we met because she wasn’t comfortable. She had never even talked with anyone about her cycles and pain (I was able to get her a diagnosis of endometriosis, adenomyosis and fibroids), because she was shy and embarrassed and honestly didn’t have any females in her life she was close to. Or at least close enough, to discuss very personal matters, And it even took her YEARS to open up to me. And that’s partially because I was so open with her and asked her so much and shared so much with her. She VERY slowly started to tell me things, ask for advice (especially once I started nursing school and then became a L&D nurse) and our relationship started to change as I got older and wasn’t just the teenager from her church class lol.
A HUGE part of her issues are pain from a childbirth injury. And it’s so embarrassing for her to talk about. Because no one knows how much of a mess she is “down there”, because she hid it her whole life. So for example when she needs to pee, if she holds it too long, she gets these sharp shooting pains down into her “area”. She will often have an accident at that point. It happened a few times when I was younger and we were together because I just didn’t understand and she didnt make needing to find a bathroom, sound like a huge deal. Long story short, she’s had a few very embarrassing moments when we’ve been together and she started to explain to me what she was experiencing. So now, I’m SUPER sensitive to her needs and while I can’t understand exactly the pain she has, as a female with the same parts, I can imagine and emphasize with her.
Her sons cannot. No matter how much they love her, they can’t really understand what she’s dealing with or how it affects her in every area of her life.
The boys don’t know, when their parents separated years ago for a couple years, it was mostly due to bedroom issues because of her pain and his lack of compassion. And she never wanted them to know (obviously!!! Also what kid wants to know that about their Mom and especially what son?!?)
Dignity as a casualty just hit the nail on the head! I love that phrase and I’m definitely going to use it going forward. Especially as a nurse who deals with a lot of that kinda stuff.
The older my friend gets, the more independence she looses, the more I’m seeing her struggle emotionally. All these issues she’s kept hidden and to herself for so many years, are suddenly all coming to a head at once. Sometimes it’s not even that she needs practical help. She just wants someone with her, who gets it and who she doesn’t have to explain every little detail to. Someone who can recognize that she’s struggling so we just sit in the car and take a few mins. Someone who can give her a hug and tell her what she’s feeling is normal and understandable and not her fault.
And her boys just can’t do that because they DON’T know the extent of her issues/trauma. And that’s not her fault or theirs….. it’s just the situation. But I’m caught in the middle. And I’ll protect her dignity until my last breath.
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Also would LOVE any advice about taking her to drs appointments from someone else who “gets it”. We always look up female providers and I will drive her hours in any direction for a female provider. Sometimes though, a male is unavoidable. And I keep her as covered as possible, never leave her side, and make sure she is being listened to about her own body and not rushed. She has a lot of anxiety leading up to these appointments though (I’m sure you can imagine how well that works with her very overactive bladder lol). And I would LOVE any advice you have about making these trips, easier for her. You sound a lot like her :)
Why would she want her sons tending to her privates? If you weren't available, she'd likely hire a female nurse. DUH. Last thing both of you need to worry about is "hurting her son's feelings."
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so when she gets a referral to a specialist 30/45 mins away, her boys don’t understand why she refuses it and I find her a female provider 2.5 hours away. They say it’s a waste of time, gas ect, when we have excellent providers, close by. And if they took her to the one close by, she wouldn’t need me to take her, cause she wouldn’t need as many bathroom trips ect.
They have no idea about her severe PTSD in that area. Or why she feels so much more comfortable with me taking her places so if she does need the bathroom, or has an accident or even just a panic attack, I can be there to help her and support her, in ways she just isn’t comfortable asking them for help with.
They just think she’s a shy/modest person and has a “small bladder” and needs to pee often. They have no idea the extent of her issues, trauma or pain. Not to mention the emotional component. So they don’t really understand WHY she wants me to take her and be there, instead of them.
And when it comes to just simple personal care, they are usually very appreciative of the help. It’s more become an issue with her feeling more comfortable with me taking her to appointments. This is mostly due to her bladder issues and mobility restrictions right now and just needing extra help and compassion and understanding.
She doesn’t want to have to explain what she’s feeling (physically) and why she can’t hold her urine for very long. She has pain down there and lack of control and occasionally accidents. And she just doesn’t want to have her sons help her with that. Plus she has severe PTSD and gynaecological trauma from a male doctor back when she had her 2nd child. So she struggles with male doctors and any private issues and sometimes just because she’s anxious, her bladder/bowels will start to act up and she will need a bathroom urgently. When that happens, people don’t understand the level of urgency she has of that she can’t just “wait”. Waiting can result in a painful experience and also embarrassing accidents. And when she’s in the car, and has to go, she doesn’t like inconveniencing people, especially when they are “helping” her. So she’s more likley to try and hold it. And the last time that happened, I was waiting for her when she got home. Knowing she would likley need a hand and a trip to the washroom. Her son came in when they got home and said she wanted me to come to the car. When I got there to help her inside, she was in tears and excruciating pain from trying to hold it so long and keep a smile on her face. And I couldn’t even get her into the house before she completely lost control. And it wasn’t easy for her to try and walk like that when she had to go so badly. It was awful. And she still ended up having an accident.
Meanwhile, if it had JUST been her and I in the car, she would have told me in a silly way, as soon as she started to feel like she had to go. I would have found somewhere to pull off into a restaurant or something and we would have walked inside together and right into the ladies room. I would have helped her into the stall and then stepped out to give her privacy, while staying within arms reach of the door, incase she needed me. And if she did need help, I would have been right there and knew how to meet her needs with respect and dignity. And we would both have gotten back in the car, happy and chatting and with her dignity intact and her privacy respected. And we would have come home with her comfortable and happy.
Her sons, just don’t get why she has to a.) go so often, b.) can’t hold it like other people her age, c.) is much more sensitive down there……. And overall, just needs more emotional support for appointments and sometimes has panic attacks. And why she’s not okay, being alone in an exam room, with a male dr. Why she’s WANTS another female there, but one she knows and is comfortable with.
And because they don’t know about what happened to her years ago and why she has issues, they just offer these simple solutions that don’t really address the core issues of why she does or doesn’t want to do something.