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I don't think it was explained correctly. Shouldn't be a matter of assets but of LIFE! Try again, explain that just the deployment of an air bag could kill an elderly person, don't forget about how they would feel if they were to cause death to themselves or others. Moms Dr did just that! She felt she could but the scratches and scrapes on the vehicle said differently. I'm sorry but this is... guilt trip included, has to be to protect everyone. You were right to take the keys away, you just saved lives! Mostly the ones you love! There will be some adjustments to be made as far as transportation but it will work out.
There comes a time when age is a factor and you can't sing and dance to make it happy for everyone. Truth,as hard as it is,must be told, do it now and show some research if necessary.
Tell them you love and want them to be with you as long as possible.
Be strong! If possible, ask them to give the car to the younger ones in the family, they could use their help! Make them feel that they could better anothers life instead of taking a life. Yes,I know this says guilt trip all over the place! It's bad but can only get better if you put it into perspective. You won't lose them if you took the keys, you get lots of crap but you still have them! It's worth it!!!
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You did good.
No, you DO NOT trust your mom to do what is necessary for all concerned (for their safety).

Also, notify the police dept that he may be driving so they may be on the 'lookout.' And, maybe a 'visit' from the local police to their door saying / reaffirming that he is not allowed to drive may help them see how serious this is. (If the police are willing to do this).

You do not want your dad to kill himself, your mother, anyone else.

You made the right decision. Just be sure that they cannot get another set of keys made.

You do not explain or set up a "I'm right" and "you're wrong" - this never works.
You state your case / situation:
* DI revoked / taken away due to cognitive decline.
* Unable to legally drive.
* Period / end of story.

And, no they will certainly not like how you are handling this although remember they are more 'angry' and 'frustrated' about him declining and losing independence. They are scared. Hopefully, you will be able to switch / shift the conversation to his 'real' feeling (losing himself, scared, etc).

Gena / Touch Matters
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Hopeforhelp22 Jun 2023
Touchmatters/Gina, I'm trying to understand your advice because I've questioned it before without a response back, and it's usually along the same lines. For example, why does everything have to be so dramatic? In your feedback here, I feel like it's always so dramatic and dark - such as, "arranging a visit for the police to come by...actually referencing to the father about his cognitive decline...using words like 'angry' and 'frustrated' and declining and losing independence...and they are scared..his real feelings of losing himself, etc." 

And then you leave off with advising the care giver to try to reason with the parent, and go into this role-play of how to deal with them to make them feel better. Do you know what it's like to be in the muck and chaos of care giving a parent - to then feel the pressure of providing perfect words to them - which doesn't really change the outcome anyway? How much pressure can a care giver take? The amount of reasoning you can even get from an elderly person with cognitive issues is almost impossible. It sounds good playing it out, but to do in reality - not so much.

Isn't it easier just to flip a situation into a positive and simplify it rather than to get into this heavy, intense conversation with an elder? For me, when it came time for my father to stop driving (due to his starting to drive slower and less steady), I just said to him, "Well, now you're really lucky - you can get a cab to drive you wherever and it's like being chauffeured around - you've earned it...now you don't need to deal with parking and traffic - you'll feel freer now." And that was it - I told him that hardly anyone was driving at his age anymore and using a taxi is the trendy thing to do.

And that's it - no heavy talks - I certainly don't want to get into his head to try to analyse him - in fact, the lighter I made it, the easier the transition was. My parents got used to calling cabs and got to know the cab drivers, who were so kind to them - and they actually started enjoying it. It's all in the way it's re-framed - instead of making it like it was a punishment, I turned it into a positive/ luxury.

I just didn't understand your suggestion of confronting a senior with words like "fear" and "scary" - maybe they're not feeling that way in every case, so why put it out there? And really, if they are scared or fearful, isn't it just better to present a positive recourse instead?
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I cannot edit without all my formatting disappearing.
This is a new issue in this website's technical / technology and I hope they fix it.

I forgot to add:

It sounds like your mother should not be driving either.
Has she been tested (MD / dementia) / DMV / ability to drive) ?
Might be a good idea to insist she gets tested also.

In how I read this, if you DECIDE to return the car keys to your mother, you are also responsible for the damage your dad may cause - be it injury to him / your mom / others or killing someone. You DO NOT want this to be on you - you keep / take away the keys. Period.

If you need someone there with you to have this 'discussion,' bring your troops - family, friend, or invite a police person to join you.

Gena / Touch
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Reply to Oburgmom3: If your Mom can't say "not going to happen" to your Dad's intent to drive, then I amend my earlier responses. Unfortunately, sometimes older adults can't see or admit to obvious decline that is clearly evident to others. My husband was entirely cooperative with no longer driving, but not everyone is. Personally, my independence is really important but not at the potential cost of someone's life or physical safety on the road.
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Oburgmom3: Your parents should not have access to vehicle keys.
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My mom was very angry when doc said you have dementia and should not be driving. She hadn't even realized that I'd already taken her keys from her purse and the spare set from the key rack. It was winter and she didn't want to drive in icy conditions, etc. She brought it up many, many times, but it just falls on deaf ears. I can't let her drive, knowing she could kill someone. Nope.
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Hi Oburgmon, I'm coming into this question late, so you may have already made a decision. You stated in your profile that your father has Alzheimer's and your mother is showing some cognitive decline. Therefore, this would be an accident waiting to happen by letting either of them have the keys. There's no reason for it. Neither of them would have the right judgement - and trying to reason with them would be futile. It just wouldn't work - in fact, it would be negligent.

It's doing them a favor by removing the keys - it's not a punishment - it's helping them. They may not understand it right now, but it's more important to keep them safe, as well as others on the road. They've lived long enough to know that sometimes there have to be compromises in life. Thankfully there's lots of alternatives and it's a matter of pivoting to using ubers or cabs - and just about anything can be ordered online - even groceries.

Maybe you can just fib a little and tell them that the keys were requested back by the DMV !
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I think you missed my point.

My concern is that no one gets injured or killed when he's driving (or your mother).

As you state, my comment(s) are dramatic. The potential of a person(s) being injured or killed due to someone driving isn't dramatic to me. The results are a real possibility. Thus, my comment about having a police officer involved 'somehow.'

Clearly see the situation / need differently.

I only offer suggestions based on my experience and training with people inflicted with dementia (over the last 8-12 years).

That you suggest giving the keys back to your mother was / is a red flag to me.
I cannot imagine why you would even consider doing this?

However, I will bow out now as my comments seem to cause you more stress than being helpful. You will do what you feel is right in this situation. Gena
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And, NO.
You absolutely do not 'try' to reason with a person with dementia.
You talk to them in a way that works for YOU.
You never ever argue with a person with dementia.

Yes, I stated 1, 2, 3. However, each person needs to respond to a parent (or anyone they are responsible for who should not be driving) in a way that works.
None of us are there with you.

Please do not blast me for trying to intervene before someone is injured or killed. And, we are all here trying to help out as best we can, even me. If you do not like what I say, then fine. Ignore me and move on.
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This is how it would go in my BIL’s family if he let his mom have the keys but his dad couldn’t drive:

Mom: meek spirit, quiet and mousy
Dad: a bit overbearing but overall nice and has a large personality

Dad waits for mom to go to the toilet and then dad takes the car keys and goes for a joy ride.

Mom doesn’t know where he went or and she can’t really think about what to do after it takes her several minutes to realize he took the car. She doesn’t want to make him mad, so she goes and prays that no one gets hurt. She doesn’t tell anyone dad took the car keys while she was on the toilet because it makes both of them look bad and the kids might start talking about AL again.

I’m sorry if this comes across as derivative. I don’t mean it to be. I think it coudl be a LOT a of responsibility placed on mom to gatekeep the car keys. Maybe she doesn’t really need that job.

We can only comment on the words written without knowing the people involved.

Again, my 2 cents which might be worth nothing. It’s all hard. I know it’s hard trying to talk to them. I know.
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Seems your mom can not hold firm with your dad about him NOT driving. Hold onto the keys. Get mom evaluated for her own mental capacity. If she also has cognitive issues, help them to sell the car and find other ways to get around.
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