Mom age 91 with vascular dementia, has been in MC for 17 months. After a phone call yesterday that she is sick, I'm thinking I wouldn't know the first thing to do if she dies. My brother and I are both 70+. I am POA and will executor. Brother lives in Mom's house. I would like to avoid exorbitant attorney fees if possible. I found her will which divides everything equally between my brother and me. Is there some place I can find simple directive steps to follow? Or are there legal trip-ups that really need an attorney? TIA
If you don't have arrangements for a funeral home, you might decide now who you are going to use and have the phone number handy for transport. Call the social worker at the facility and ask them what they would need to know upon her passing so you can gather the info.
She has a will, but is there anything that must go through a probate? Some folks have lady bird deeds (or similar) on the house that transfer house deed to someone upon death. The house is taken care of and is not part of estate to divide up. Do her bank accounts have another name on them with transfer upon death? Insurance policies with beneficiary listed. Those should not need probate.
If things are in her name that have to be sorted out in probate court, and no one is contesting anything, it's probably just a routine probate. Shop around for an atty and have all assets listed with agreed to distribution of property when you go. Should make it easier and cheaper. State to state, property division, taxes, etc vary - so that's why it's best to get an atty.
Is your mother terminal or just temporarily sick? I thought you were going to ask what to do about her physical remains. If she is terminal, you might want to choose a Funeral Home or Cremation Service to set up arrangements ahead of time for when they are needed.
https://www.aarp.org/home-family/friends-family/info-2020/when-loved-one-dies-checklist.html
Call Social Security to report death (there’s a phone number for this purpose, google it. You’ll need her SS number. We did this almost immediately so check would be stopped from being deposited (in which case, SS will withdraw those funds from the account, at their convenience).
Notify funeral home to come for body of the deceased (decide on which one you prefer before a loved one’s death). If you want to spend time or have others come and spend time with your loved one’s remains, convey to funeral home. If interment is in a Veteran’s Cemetery, let funeral home know. They might help with arrangements. You’ll need service discharge papers (this can also be done in advance planning with the cemetery).
just my thoughts from experience...thinking of you as you make preparations for a difficult time
While my sister was in hospice care, I arranged her cremation and internment with a local family-run funeral home. (Hospice had suggested this.) Paying ahead for "direct cremation" was about $1200, and included pick-up, cremation, death certificates, published obituary, and delivery of the ashes to me in a container. This was so convenient, not having to haggle over prices with funeral homes during grieving, that I have paid for my own this way. The price never rises, which is also reassuring.
I was on my sister's bank account as "In Trust For," and I could access the funds immediately after her death. This was very helpful. After my various experiences as an Executor, I have now put my Executor's name on my bank accounts, mobile home deed, and car title, all as "co-owner." This way she can immediately access my funds, and sell the home and car with no waiting periods.
Of course, no estate of "high value," which none of the above were, can avoid probate without a trust or attorney's advice in some way. I hope some of these pieces of advice are helpful.
Id like to add suggestions as to probate. As far as how probate can run is totally dependent on your states laws. I’ve been an Executor x3 and each time it’s been somewhat different. The first thing ime is to determine if you have a valid will to present to Probate court to start the process. Look over her will, if is notarized and witnessed and original, you’ll probably be ok. Court wants the original, so make copies. If the will looks problematic, or is a holographic will, do full stop and get a probate attorney as this turns into dealing with intestate process or validation of person and it’s not a DIY imo.
Second I’d suggest that you do a quick estimate of what her likely debt and assets are and if anything has an “encumbrance” aka debt that’s securitized like a mortgage or car note. If she does, I’d again do a full stop and find a probate attorney. Probate has loads of filings that have pretty specific format and if there’s debts those likely have releases that need to be done, plus doing correct NOC (notice to creditors) filings, and doing correct distribution request to PC judge.
if she died owing zero, home & car in her name and you have all the original various Release of Deed of Trust or Titles for all real property and you are pretty comfortable in a courthouse, in that rare situation imho you can DIY it.
If so the next step would be to find out what levels of probate your states does and which format your moms Estate fits. Most states have 2, some have 3: 1. Small Estates Affadavit; 2. Muniment of Title; 3. Full / traditional probate where executor is named via Letters Testamentary and determined to be Independent Administration or Dependent Adminstration.
If she was on Medicaid after age 55, estate recovery (MERP) will likely be involved in some way. Just how very very much interdependent on how Medicaid does it for your state, like if they have outside contractor. Also your states laws on property rights & if exemption, exclusions or other probate related issues(Lady bird deed, Testamentary Trust, cost analysis for recovery) factor in big time.
If it’s just you & your Bro as heirs, and y’all get along, you can take your time to deal with probate. As others mentioned, most require a waiting period before anything can “open”. During this period there needs to be a call out to creditors in some way. Some states have set time for probate to close by while others allow probate to remain open till forever.
The formats for filings are exacting. Probate attorneys usually do all filings from preset formats - once initial in person is done- via on online portal that is tied to their bar #. The costs for probate should be low due to this unless there's issues.
The day of death will affect the taxes on any property that have a personal exemption. Like a homestead exemption. Property taxes will increase, perhaps significantly. In order to transfer title all taxes must be paid. So have your wallets prepared. You may want to prepay utilities and insurance too cause if there’s a credit balance they probably cannot require you to come in and change the name of the accounts (at best) or require completely new accounts be opened with a deposit (sigh!).
My sister and I met with the funeral director the day after the death, and we dictated details, so either they had gone ahead before we got there, or the people doing this were, shall we say, not "rocket scientists"--and after meeting a couple of the staff members, I suspect the latter.
Yoy should make a copy of the Will and discuss with your brother what his plans are since, no doubt you want the home sold so you can get your half of the home price.
If your brother wants to continue living in the home, he will need to pay you half of the homes value.
You could discuss it now abs tell him you'll have a Realtor come out to evaluate the home so your brother can see if he has the half up front to pay you for your share of the home or if it will be sold and the proceeds split between the two of you.
Your moms bank accounts should already have yours or your brother's name on them or at least have POD which is payable upon death and all you would need to get the money out is to show them a copy of the death certificate.
All estates will be prorated but it doesn't take thst long or expense when there is a will unless anyone in the will fights it.
Although the funeral home notifies Social Security, CALL SS office; if she has any kind of military stipend they need to be called which includes TriCare. They are NOT notified. Still I would call Social Security immediately after she dies. When mom died I soon called the military (she was receiving a small stipend) including Tri-Care. I must stress, YOU have to call them. Nobody will notify them. I also notified the county commissioners as I pay homeowner's property taxes
Definitely pre-plan funeral arrangements because the funeral home will gouge you during grief. Preplanning is the only way to prevent that. You also get discounts for preplaning.
Without estate planning an estate attorney is unavoidable. You may want to contact the county to see if you are eligible for legal aid. Good luck.
Here is a good guide--:
https://www.agingcare.com/articles/estate-administration-probate-after-death-in-family-153107.htm
Unless one has been down this road, it is probably best to consult with estate atty or a GOOD financial person (I started having mom's and the trust taxes done with Enrolled Agent, as they are IRS "approved" and have to stay up to date with any/all changes.) My mother's cousin passed many years ago and her sister, who wasn't local AND not well herself, was executor. The atty they were using was USELESS and very difficult to contact. A year and a day later, the sister also passed away. Through much wrangling to find out what was going on, I finally was told I was named the alternate (first I heard about it!) I immediately hired another attorney and it still took 2 years to finalize everything (the atty AND the sister really mucked things up!)
when I knew dad was nearing death I began to make a checklist of all the people I needed to notify, for instance, his rental insurance required by the facility where he lived, his pension, his magazine subscriptions, forwarded his mail to my home, his drug and health insurance plan, stock companies, and eventually I will close his credit card and bank. Right now they remain open as we haven’t closed the estate and I am on both of them.
the funeral home handles notifying social security which includes Medicare and will order the death certificates. Figure out how many you will need as they aren’t free.
as for a funeral, dad was 98+ and we had it prepaid. But since it was closed casket there was no need for embalming. So you can avoid that fee if you aren’t cremating. We had a simple gravesite service that we did and a few family attended. Played some hymns he liked and it was meaningful. It is good you are thinking about this now.
I was executor for my dad. I contacted a friends brother who is an attorney. He gave me a free consultation. Dad left everything to Mom and had pretty minimal assets so we didn’t need to go to probate.
The funeral home will get the death certificate and send it to you. Get several copies to send with applications for redeeming life insurance, etc. The bank will probably want one to close out accounts. And if you need to sell real property you will need proof of ownership.
You will need to notify Social Security and any agency that may be providing a pension, IRA, or other income producing investments. Some might want a death certificate too. The Life Insurance company responded pretty quickly as most people need that money for funeral expenses.
As far as handling the division of her assets, I wouldn't have the first clue about that since I'm an only child and everything my folks had was put into my name in 2014. I just wanted to address the cremation portion of the matter.
Good luck!
Your immediate concern is to pre plan a funeral. The funeral home will help with a lot of things such as notifying Social Security of the passing. The will needs to be filed with the Surrogate. I had to do a lot of the work online because of covid. And you do have to wait 10 days before that process.
Once that is done you can go to the banks and get an estate account set up and work on closing other accounts. Some banks are very easy to work with, others not so much (FYI Bank of America is very difficult).
I was told by one bank that you should leave an estate account open for at least 2 years. You also have to get an EIN number for your deceased as their SS# is no longer valid. I am still waiting on his annuity to release his funds to me even though I was named beneficiary and I provided the with all the necessary paperwork months ago. I am not sure why all this has to be so hard.
In my state its 9 or 10 days before you can probate the Will. You will take the Will to the County Probate office to have it filed. You will get a copy and pay a fee for a Short Certificate which will give u the authority to get to Moms financial accts and work with creditors. I did all the footwork when it came to getting tax IDs for the state and Federal governments. Probate should give you all the info needed. Since you and brother are the only beneficiaries, you may not have to Probate. All depends on the size of Moms estate.
The only reason I got a lawyer is because my brother inherited the house and didn't want it so paperwork needed to be drawn up for the house to go back to the estate. He was a family friend so from that point he took over. He made sure all my paperwork was in order. Handled the sale of the house and did the final accounting. His fees were paid by the sale of the house. If you and brother can agree on everything, you may not need a lawyer.
I do see maybe the house being a problem if you plan on turning over ur half to brother? Having him buy you out? Sell and split the proceeds? This you may need a lawyer for.
Don't let yourself get overwhelmed. Probate does not happen overnight. In my State you can't close out for at least 8 months. You have to give creditors time to make any claims on the estate. For me, Mom was gone 2 months before I even started Probate. So don't get ahead of yourself. One step at a time.
There are many books about serving as POA and Trustee and Executor. Go to Amazon and look for them. I poured through a ton of them.
I spent only 1 1/2 hour in attorney office to administer my brother's Trust and Estate. Under 1,000.00 and the best money I ever spent.
The more you know the more you can do yourself.
However I tried to get my own EIN to help things move along, but due to Covid 19 the IRS is working from home and it took three months for them to write back with a question for me. I finally had Lawyer do it online; took her minutes to get it.
I found this book easy and useful for a start:
Title: Please Don't Die! But if You Do WHAT DO I DO NEXT? Written by Kurt Grube and Keith S. Grube, Esq. with John Nevola
As Windy said, it’s good to pre plan her funeral and make Necessary expenditures while you are still POA, Perhaps you are already co owner of her bank account which will make things easier after she passes. If not, you will need Letters of Testamentary showing you have the authority to make transactions for the estate and that can take awhile.
And do you know plans for mom’s house? Will brother be moving out or do you plan to have him buy out your share and him remain there?
I’ve found that estate attorneys aren’t horribly expensive and their time is worth paying for, they tend to think of things I wouldn’t have considered
Keep in mind that your POA ends upon her death. You can no longer write checks on her accounts.
Have the funeral home provide you with plenty of death certificates. You’ll need this for probate, insurance, bank accounts etc.
Hopefully you have a signed original of her will.
If you have to go through probate you almost have to get a lawyer. I’m going through probate now with my dads estate. I’m lucky as my wife is an attorney. I could never have gotten through on my own.