How can I bring up a care decision issue with family members in a gentle way?

throwaway101, I thought you had just updated us yesterday that your mom was finally stepping up more and giving you much needed breaks on the weekends and such, and that you were grateful for that as you now had more time to do things you enjoy. Has that changed since yesterday?
I know your mom works full time during the week and isn't home much to help you, and since it sounds like there's not much help available where you are,(although I'm sure there are care facilities of some sort that grandma could go into)so other than running away from home and starting the life you want and deserve, I don't know of any other options for you.
Like most of us told you on here before, your grandmothers care IS NOT your responsibility. Period, end of sentence.
Your grandmother has had her life and now you deserve to have yours. But it's going to take courage on your part to make the necessary changes to make that happen, so quit letting your mom use and abuse you.

Your mom most likely doesn't want to accept the reality, and instead of making a plan she wants to just bury her head in the sand.

My family is the same way, and being on this forum has made me realize how long this could go on also.

But your circumstances are so much more dire than mine. I'm not sure how the best is for you to go about this. Hopefully you get a lot of ideas here.

Maybe just keep telling her , mom you do know this could go on for years and we need a plan, and I need to start my life.

Maybe even tell her how are you ever going to take care of her in her aging years, if you don't make something of your life, because of Grandma and mostly because of mom putting all this burden on you, moms going to have to financially take care of you your whole life , and there be no one to take care of her

Not that you have to when the time comes. I'm just trying to think the way your mom thinks and what may wake her up.

Which is hard because of the cultural differences here. But I'm very glad you came back. We will try to help you the best we can.

Because to us you are not , throwaway!

Without knowing where you live specifically, we can't give you useable guidance. Here in the U.S. there are options and strategies that may probably aren't available where you live.

If you revealed what country you live in, then someone on this global forum may have solutions for you.

Does your country have something equivalent to America's social services? Every county in every state has this.

You've already tried to broach the topic with your Mom and got shut down because she has no solutions, either -- or doesn't like what the alternative would be. She's probably very burnt out and would love to give it up herself but doesn't see how that is possible.

If you told her that you are done as of XX date (like 30 or 60 days) then it will force her to talk to you about other options. But you will have to be resolute and not change your mind or extend your participation.

I would be researching this topic for your resident country. Surely there must be some sort of social program for elders who have no family to care for them?

First of all since you do most of the caregiving you are the primary caregiver 5 days a week .

Are there no nursing homes where you live ? How is this handled by other families in your country ? I know I already asked you in your other thread if this was common where children get pulled out of school at a young age to become caregivers and you answered “ No not at all.”

If there are nursing homes , why is Mom resistive to placing grandma in one ? Or is it the cost that is the problem . Is there no government help for elders who can’t afford a nursing home ?

We’ve already told you in your last thread that you need to tell Mom that you can’t do this anymore . Find a way to leave . Get a job on the weekends now save travel money so you can leave , then go back to your original country and find a job , possibly join the military so you will have free housing or work on a cruise ship company , or any other paying job that you can get free housing until you save more money to be able to get an apartment and a new job.

I don’t know how bringing it up softer is going to make any difference when your mother thinks there is nothing that can be done differently. You will need to just find a way to leave .

For now , just tell Mom that for your mental health you will not be home most of the weekend and save the money you make from a job . Do not give your money to your mother . Do not have your mother’s name on your bank account . You do not owe your mother any money , rent or any expenses. You are already working as a full time caregiver for free . You are the one they owe money to . Free room and board doesn’t equate to nearly what the work you have done is worth . You should be getting paid on top of free room and board .

I would softly tell Mom that your mental health is suffering and you need ways to find help for that . Including getting a paid job and meeting people , friends your own age. I think you should also go out at least one weekday evening as well . I would keep reminding Mom she needs to find another solution because you can not do this forever .

I find it hard to believe that there is nowhere to place a person with severe mental health problem like your grandmother has . If I recall you said she’s schizophrenic and has dementia and throws feces around the home . Since you told me in your other thread that it’s not common for teens to be pulled out of school for caregiving , there must be nursing homes or psychiatric hospitals . Your mother is just refusing to place your grandmother . Your mother most likely has a guilty feeling about doing it . You have been the one your mother is sacrificing here . Get out , find a way to leave .

Gentle & soft...
Go with polite but honest.
Take courage!!
You have this!

I think there is no gentle way to do this and that there is no need to rehash the advice given to you in your previous post.

You have to decide what you want out of your life.

There is no "gentle" way to do this properly. To do this it requires HONESTY. Your mother knows how to hold you at bay quite easily by reacting. You will have to sit her down and tell her that you are sorry she is saddled with so much care, but that you as the grandchild must now leave caregiving to have your own life. Give her the time frame in which you will leave off this care, because if you do not the care of your grandmother will move on to the care of your mother, and as you can see with your own mother, you will then be caring for your MOM. And yes, you will spend your life in all this.

To be honest, in your own answer, with the other country and the other cultural values, the only answer is to MOVE AWAY and to do it at once. Move miles away. Start education and career so that you can care for YOURSELF and have your own life. Otherwise you will be a slave to the elders lifelong. It will make NO ONE HAPPY and you will have wasted your own life by throwing it on the burning funeral pyres of the elderly.

If talking won't work, write a letter and leave home for a week.

You've posted here before and everyone pretty much gave you the same answers they're giving you now. Nothing changed.

No one here is going to help you financially or sponsor you to move to the Unites States, western Europe, or Australia where many of the members of this forum are from. I think this is what you may be getting at and that's not gonna happen.

You say you're looking for work. Why would your pay have to go through your mother? Are you not legal in th country you live in? If you're planning on staying in the country you live in, you need to get legal so you can work legally.

In the meantime do you have any friends or family you can stay with while you look for work? If you get a job maybe and start paying whatever friend or family who takes you in, they will want you to stay. It's worth a shot.

Or as others have suggested on a previous thread, perhaps the military would be a possibility for you. Or the same line of work your mother does. You have said she's only home on weekends. Does she stay at her job during the week?

You don't have a lot of choices here, so you should get serious about the limited ones you do have.

There is no "gentle" way to tell your family that there needs to be a different care plan.

The fact of it is your grandmother is out-of-it with dementia and can't put two and two together and mother doesn't want to take care of her. So that leave you and so long as you maintain the status quo in the home, everything will stay as it is.

Find a job first then find a friend to stay with.

You don’t tell them gently that you quit being a slave. You need to get mad for yourself, and then you need to act.

Your mom took you out of junior high to care for a demented schizophrenic. She is not going to be reasonable no matter what your tone. And as long as you keep worrying about the feelings of this child abuser, nothing will change.

Throwaway, being different custom, and everything your going to get a different opinion. Everyone is going to feel strongly that you need your own life to build your life. Some my have ways of doing that, in are area that you may not agree with, or be next to impossible for you to do.

Id say take one step at a time , which you have started. And I commened you for taking that first step.

It's about 2 steps forward, one step back, keep moving forward and don't stop, if you take a step backwards, it happens, just brush your self off and move forward.

One thing I do know some may not have the right suggestion that work for your customs or country, but here the biggest thing is, WE CARE" and everything we say is because we care.

In my opinion, you need to get some self esteem, that is in my opinion your next step, that's meaning if you can not do what really needs to be done , which is leave. Your name only shows me you have no, self easteem. YOU MATTER, get that drilled into you head.

You need to get yourself, emotionally, physically, and mentally stronger. .

From your update it seems you have made the choice to remain in this abusive situation so you'll have to accept the consequences of that, I'm truly sorry but the harsh reality is nobody can wave a magic wand that allows you to have both your family and your freedom.

If you can not alter the situation you are in now (and I have to disagree, Hospice is in every country please check on that)
I think you now need to set boundaries and tell your mom, dad if you have one that you will NOT do the same for them and they have to begin to make other arrangements.

Your mother is in denial.
She has to begin to see what you are going through. (is it possible that she was doing what you are doing when she was your age with another relative maybe your great grandmother an aunt? Maybe that is why she can't see, it is an a generational expectation)

You do have the option of just simply walking away.
Somehow, someway your mom will find a way to have her mother cared for. Either she will step up or there will be a caregiver that will step in.
But I am guessing since you have been doing this for quite some time you have no support system, friends, savings of any kind or a way to leave. So you remain stuck! I am sorry for that. You are to young to be forced into this servitude.

Throwaway, some people, forget or may not understand that changing your life doesn't happen over night, so please don't leave, take the advice that works for you and ignore the advice that you don't like, there are many people here with different thoughts.

You can also private message anyone if you choose to do that.

Throw, I feel that you’re looking for us to affirm your mother and to feel sorry for her. Unfortunately this approach won’t work toward someone that took their child out of junior high.

If your grandma isn’t on antipsychotics, she as a schizophrenic needs to be on them. If she is flinging her poop, then she needs to be in diapers with an anti strip onesie. If your mother refuses then she can clean fecal matter once she gets home. On the weekends, mommy can clean her mom’s vagina and anus. You meanwhile will be working not just for the money but also the experience.

If mom is hard to talk to, why not write her a letter? Then she can read it and maybe absorb what you're trying to tell her....really HEAR you without having to respond or react right away. That will give her a chance to think about what you are saying. She probably does feel stuck, so this may not work either, but it's worth a try.

It's hard for Americans to understand a mother who would take a child out of school to care for a grandparent. We have laws here that stop such a thing from happening.

If you are able to work on weekends and save money, you'll need to move out and leave mom to figure out the grandma problem on her own. It's not that you don't love her, it's that what is happening to you is wrong. Because mom feels stuck is no reason to enslave you in this role. Trust me, once you're gone, she WILL figure something else out. But don't leave until you are ready.

We sympathize with you, we just look at things a bit differently in the USA than elsewhere. Wishing you the very best of luck.

Throw, it might help to actually visualize a goal. In your case, I would visualize a contract on a cruise ship. You spend 12 hour days pouring drinks, serving food, being a camp counselor for kids, housekeeping etc. You will room with another female or females in a hostel type of environment for free. The food will be good, plentiful, and free. You can see a shipboard doctor for free. You will earn at least 4000 a month and much of that will be tax free. In six months, you get an extended break for two months during which time you can work on land in multiple countries. By a year, you now have close to 100k.

If you read this, it’s good to know that you are planning what to do so that you do not end up on the street with nothing. But please know that there is no way to make these difficult discussions and decisions ‘in a gentle way’. When you have solved difficult problems for other people, and then back away, the other people always react badly. Just know that it will happen, and it’s part of the cost for getting your life on track. Very best wishes, Margaret

I've read most of the responses. It certainly is up to you whether you read them or don't write here anymore as I believe you said.

As in all (or certainly 99.9% of life situations), we do not change until we decide we develop confidence in ourself - that we deserve - other or more than what we currently have. In this situation, it seems like the issue is how you feel about your mother (guilt, fear, respect/cultural training from before you could walk) and more. Certainly, this is NOT an easy situation for you - or for anyone. Although being young and in another country adds intense pressures on you.

GIVE YOURSELF CREDIT FOR REACHING OUT HERE FOR SUPPORT.

How you proceed is certainly a decision you need to make.
Realize that asserting yourself (with your mother - or anyone in or representing an authority figure in your life) will not be easy. It will be hard and perhaps go against every fiber in your being - however, you will need to expect - and accept - those feelings and decide to 'do' what you want anyway. It is a process and you will get through it.

From what I hear, you need to decide / understand / that your grandmother is first your mother's responsibility, not yours. The question is: Can you do this?

Once you do, you relieve yourself of the pressures put on you - by your mother and yourself.

I understand you are - as we sometimes say 'between a rock and a hard place.' You need the support of your mother in some ways to move on, you fear losing her and that support - to move on.

The question is - your mother may be - likely will be extremely resistant to any changes in the current situation as she doesn't have to take on responsibilities that are hers (her mother). She likely will respond to you in anger or upset - wanting to keep you there / keep the situation as it is.

It is YOUR mother's responsibility to figure out how to find support / care for her mother, not you. As long as you continue to 'be here,' your mother doesn't need to do anything, make any changes, even if it means SHE has to spend more time with her mother (even upset the 'during the week' schedule of being there, which for reasons we do not know, your mother is only available on weekends. THAT HAS TO CHANGE and it is UP TO YOUR MOTHER TO DECIDE HOW TO CHANGE IT.

I question why you do not have any friends, being a young woman.
Do you have any non-profits, agencies, organizations that could offer you some emotional support?

That you are thinking ahead of how this current situation could go on and on ... and KNOW that once your grandmother passes, your mother will expect YOU to be there for her in the same way.

You will only be able to move towards the life you want by making hard, uncomfortable decisions now. Do you trust in God? You don't not always need to see the path ahead of you to take that first step. You do it anyway - blind trust.
What would this first step look like to you?
Speakto your mother: You can be gentle in that you do not scream. You are clear, with an even tone of voice, although what you say is VERY CLEAR / definite. "Mother, I understand this is a difficult situation for us. I want to xxx (go to school, develop myself, get an education ... whatever you want to say) and I am not going to be able to take care of grandmother five days a week anymore."
"You will need to make other arrangements for her."
"I have taken on this responsibility since I was xxx (years old)."
"I need to make some decisions about my own life and how I want to live it, moving into the future."
BE VERY CLEAR on your timeline.
Before you give her specific dates of when you are not available, do your research - get a job, whatever you decide to do - and know when you need to start ... so you will know when you can tell your mother when you need to leave.
"I will continue to be grandmother's primary caregiver through xxx."

Learn to love yourself enough to go into the unknown of your own life.

Gena / Touch Matters

Throwaway,
In the end, your grandmother will be gone, your mother will be gone and you will be left with yourself. Will you like or respect the person you are left with? Will you have a family of your own to love and comfort you? Will you have developed your talents and self-esteem?
As the mother of an adult daughter, there have been times our swords have crossed in life changing ways for both of us.

This is by design!

As painful and difficult as these times have been they were necessary for us to learn to see each other as autonomous human beings and not just a mass of familial cells.

Mom will either accept your choices with grace or she will accept your choices with resentment but either way, she will respect you for making them, eventually.

It sounds like your mother is dumping HER responsibility onto you and that is wrong. I hate to be so blunt, but it's the truth. You MUST find someone in your area to help you get your grandmother into assisted living and go live the one life God gave you to live. As a mother, I would NEVER put this burden on my child. You deserve better...

You are the primary caregiver if you spend 5 days of the week caring for your GM and mom does it only over the weekends. You have to make the calls regarding the care process.

You have to make a decision whether you want to continue the same process until your GM passes away, ending with not finished education, no family of your own, no career, and no life. Your mom is not willing to talk to you because she knows your situation in untenable and she knows that she does not have a good alternative.

GM deserves to be cared for, properly. If you cannot provide that care due to the situation you described, then something has to happen to change that course.

I lived for 18 years in a third world country and cared for my wife who suffered from FTD. I was the spouse, and I had made that commitment when we got married, in sickness and health... But I did it by hiring and training aides to help me in the process. It was difficult and you have to have the financial means to do it.

You have to get your life together and decide what is best for you, because you have your whole life in front of you. Caring for a spouse is a commitment. Caring for GM is not.

It is your call.

@Throwaway,

What 'WayToMisery' said!!! You're like a child that's human trafficked and is like slave labor (born into it). Now I could be wrong, since I don't have your cultural lens. However, most anywhere else on earth, educated onlookers would consider you abused. (I'm writing from USA.)

Have you considered making an escape plan? And, if/when you do, tell NO-ONE including mom/grandma! Start saving money (yes and keep it secret for yourself; don't give it to mom). Start learning from internet or abuse shelters how to make an escape plan. Safety first. This includes psychological safety. And your wellbeing, whereby your development needn't be sacrificed, halted, stunted or compromised. You are still kind and loving without having to be the sacrificial lamb. Pour some of that love, compassion and kindness onto yourself towards growing some your own future, and healing (if need be). It's NOT selfish to step into your [Godly] purpose.

Pray to creator-God; turn to Christ. Yes and ask Jesus what life that's planned for you. Pardon me. However, Christ is WITH you; loves you; and will guide you. God is not man (or woman) that "he" can lie. Ask for the Truth and the TRUTH will set you free. God is TRUTH. It's very possible that you'll NOT "see" until you separate from this situation and get some time or distance from it. While I could be wrong... I think you already know: Nature knows just what to do and so will you!!! And, however, you don't have to go it alone. Christ will walk WITH you and, if you ask for this, you will receive. One way or another God will provide. God's SPIRIT will be with you. Seek and you'll find. You've asked on this venue a time or two, apparently; and you've gathered lots of info. and considered many viewpoints. Now, there's a time for acting on the knowledge and moving forward in Faith. It sounds like you're a thoughtful planner. You'll figure it out. What do you think? How do you feel? WHAT DO YOU WANT? Now ... could you include God in these questions, if you want to? Asking because Jesus came to set the captives free. I'm hesitant for interjecting a loving Saviour into your life/culture/3rd world country experience. It's the only framework I know of (from here) that can fortify you/your heart&soul, and transform lives. Sorry?

I can only see one option. Hiring someone extra to care for Grandmother.

This may need to be a younger person to make this affordable.

#1 is safety - for Grandmother & also the caregiver. If Grandmother has behaviours that are hard to manage, this job may need to be more 'sit & supervise' than actual 'care duties'. Eg Supervising & calling Mom if Grandmother wanders off etc.

If affordable on Mom's wage, the Granddaughter can return to study.

If not, Granddaughter may need to find a job & contribute financilally so the household works.

I think I've said this before, dementia care, like child-rearing, takes a village.

Both the Mother & the Granddaughter need to involve extra people. I would be asking what is stopping that? Why are they so very isolated from their wider community?

Throwaway, in the country where you reside, what happens to senile people who don’t have anyone?

What everyone else here has said.

I don't know if you have access to find (maybe from a library or used bookstore) the book Boundaries, by Henry Cloud, but in it he states that when you set boundaries for someone who is not used to them, it is normal for them to get angry and resentful.

You are entitled to your own life. If you spend your young life taking care of your grandmother, you are giving up your normal education and what will you ultimately do to support yourself...other than to take care of others?

While this can be a noble, and fulfilling job, it also can drag you down, age you prematurely and make you resentful and depressed.

You deserve your own life...not the one your mom is saying you need to have. It's not her decision if you are an adult. Are you doing anything to further your education so you can one day graduate? Is this something you can do while caring for her? If not, it may make you feel guilty (totally human), but her present can NOT cancel your future. It's just not right. She's had her life, and you deserve yours as well.

Speaking firmly and clearly can be loving and effective at the same time. When your mother says that she doesn't know what to do, inform her that is exactly why the two of you need to talk. I'm assuming that we are talking about your mother's mother so perhaps you could use that relationship as a starting point. Include your grandmother in the discussions if possible. All of these kinds of talks are frightening. Is there someone else you could involve...another relative, a member of the clergy, a close friend who knows the family?