Hi, new here so it's great to find this resource. Myself and my husband and toddler moved in with my FIL last year to care for him after MIL passed away. He does not need 24/7 care but has early stages dementia, anxiety and depression. Family only visit when it suits them. The problem is when they do visit they come in a group of 5 or 6 at the same time (kids included) and stay late so I cannot get my daughter to bed at her routine time which causes chaos in the house and leads to a very grumpy toddler. I have reached out and asked them if they could perhaps call a little earlier so I could do the bedtime at the normal time. They Have refused and said they will call when they like and won't be told when they can and can't call. It makes me feel like I am so unwelcome in my own home. They are due to visit again soon and I am dreading it. Am I being unreasonable in what I am asking them??
It's really a shame when you are doing something kind & generous for your FIL and his own family won't compromise a bit for YOU. It must make you feel like someone who has NO VOICE at all in this home you're living in, which stinks.
I think maybe you should ask your FIL to set down some rules for the family members. I hope it works.
Best of luck.
If you would like mediation contact numbers I can give you web sites; just ask for them.
This is basically still your FIL home; I think that you should see an elder law attorney with him to get together on whether you are being paid for any care now or in the future. Whether he requires your acting as his POA and limiting visits or not. Much of the power here still rests with your FIL and an adversarial relationship with the rest of the family is going to end in a total nightmare for you. This is a matter of "can't we all just get along" and I think you all need to find a way to come to agreement and to get along WITH your FIL part of those decisions. There are worse things than a periodically grumpy up-too-late toddler. MUCH worse, and you could be heading there.
Basically, unless he has serious dementia you are down to WHAT DOES DAD WANT. And before he does, see an elder law attorney so that when he does you can act on your POA to limit visits as you feel is needed. This all needs to be in writing, and thought out. You, as daughter in law living in your FIL's home will have little say in this matter. It is FIL first, his son second. Hard to handle when you are doing the cooking and cleaning, I know, but you took this on, hopefully not totally blindsided by who this family is.
The problem is, unless (and unfortunately, EVEN IF) you have purchased this home from your FIL, you clearly have relatives who view this as his home, and not yours; regardless of whatever care you're giving FIL. These self-same relatives might even feel that you "owe" FIL this care for "letting" and your family live in FIL's home - even if you're paying towards the household.
You and your husband might want to seriously re-think this living arrangement. You should also have some ideas for the future - like in the instance that your FIL needs placement and his house has to be sold in order to finance that. Will you and your family be left homeless should that happen?
There are too many sad stories of adult children who move in with ailing mom and/or dad, and figure that it will be a "win-win" - figuring they can save some money on living expenses, while giving needed care to mom/dad who don't want to leave their home and their "independence". Then the care becomes too much, parent(s) has to be placed, parents' assets have to be used, and adult caregiving children find themselves in a real financial bind. And often, non-caregiving relatives feel like the caregiving children should have been "saving up" for this very scenario - never giving any thought to the difficulty in maintaining a full-time job while being a 24/7 caregiver.
Make sure you have an ironclad, doable "escape plan" in place if you are going to continue on this path.
Good luck!
I would say when family visits, leave. They can care for Dad and you can get out of the house. Don't feel you need to entertain. Also, it really isn't your home.
If they want to cop this kind of attitude, let them take care of the elder. They'll change their tune if they do.
Just making sure..
Coz if there any Wife must care for my parents & must do as my siblings want vibes coming from your Husband - you may have a Husband problem, not in-laws.
My husband is totally on board with me and has 100% support. My husband actually owns the house for the past 10 years, we sold our property last year and moved in after agreement with the family so we could be there full time to look after the Dad. Yes I totally agree it is still the family house as long as his Dad is here, but surely it is our HOME. They are free to come and go as they please and always have been - with this one question about leaving the house by a certain time causing a huge drama.
We will try and leave the house when we know they are calling, and leave them some of the menial tasks to do with their Dad perhaps.
I also feel like life is too short to be dodging people in my own home and really hope perhaps if we can speak to them one at a time and ask them to explain WHY they are so upset by me and or the situation.
"They Have refused and said they will call when they like and won't be told when they can and can't call."
they sound very rude, unkind.
"but surely it is our HOME"
of course. totally agree.
in addition, your husband owns the house. it is 100% your house, your home. not theirs.
actually, it's not "the family house", it's your house.
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it's really unlucky when the people who surround us are so rude.
you dread their visits.
i understand.
one only dreads spending time with people who are awful. so they must be awful.
i don't think you should go to a hotel when they come.
1st of all, it costs money. not everyone can throw away money on a hotel, and in particular when it's not even planned because you want it, but because you have to escape your home. then you're escaping your own house + financially being penalized (you pay for the hotel) --- THEY can pay for your hotel stay. (of course they won't).
and your (forced) "holiday"/hotel stay shouldn't be dictated by them, when they want you to go on "holiday".
i mean, if you want to go to a hotel, of course do so.
i'm not saying going to a hotel is throwing away money. i just mean that, ideally it should be fun, not something that's forced by someone else.
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it comes down to, how to deal with rude people.
i have rude people in my family too (3 awful, rude, older brothers).
i do believe in karma (or whatever you want to call it). how you treat others will eventually bite you back.
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i hope the visiting family in your house starts behaving better, and leaving earlier.
the only way, sometimes, to deal with rude people, is to have as little to do with them as possible. avoid them.
they'll ruin your day.
sometimes, one's mind will continue thinking about their rudeness for hours/days. so you see, they steal a lot of time.
when i can, i cut rude people out of my life.
i have pretty much cut contact with my brothers. but it's much easier for me (my brothers aren't visiting my home).
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hugs!! i hope things get better!!
Are you two planning to be FIL's 24/7/365 caregivers as he needs more and more care? If you think relatives not honoring your toddler's bedtime is an issue, just wait until you see the issues you are going to have down the road.
When the time comes (note "when" and not "if"), does your FIL have the assets for a facility? Will he be Medicaid-eligible? Does your H have POA and HCPOA?
Does FIL pay to live in H's house? If not, why not?
unfortunately true:
rude, mean people don't suddenly wake up one day and become nice. often they become ruder, meaner.
similarly:
nice, kind people don't normally wake up one day and become mean.
nice people want mean people to be nicer.
(not going to happen).
mean people, besides wanting to break people, sometimes actually want a nice person to become mean. "ha! you see! you too, behave the same way! hahahaha."
of course, i'm using words ("nice", "mean") very broadly/generally (and there are varying degrees of nice/mean)...but still, i do believe in what i'm saying.
it comes down to nice/kind people vs. mean/rude people.
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courage, to us kind people!
I realize this is not a question you posted but there are many more complexities to your arrangement (and you are finding them out one at a time). You and your husband need to understand that "aging in place" is a romanticized notion by people who have never tried to care for elders with dementia while at the same time working and raising a young family. You will wind up orbiting around the elder 24/7 because, unlike a child who is becoming more independent and can learn things, an elder with dementia is becoming more dependent and unlearning things (like that he shouldn't be driving but doesn't agree with your assessment on this, becomes incontinent for #1 AND #2 and won't keep his Depends on, says socially outrageous things daily, etc).
If you were older, retired empty nesters your arrangement would still have a profound impact on your lives. Just read some of the thousands of posts on this forum under the topic Burnout. For the near term you and your husband need to create very clear boundaries that you defend. You may not be able to avoid "offending" your in-laws because they have pre-existing expectations about their visits. Work through issues as diplomatically as possible without becoming doormats. Your child will eventually grow out of toddlerhood (but then maybe your family will grow? And then what?) Perhaps have your in-laws take your FIL for a week or 2 to give you a break and then they also learn the challenges of 24/7 caregiving. There is much good wisdom to be found on this forum so continue to read the forum topics and ask questions. I wish you much wisdom in this ongoing arrangement.
and good warnings!!
You may, if your FIL has dementia at all, need to get guardianship in order to set rules on visitation. Without it you are down to they can see Dad but in the home on YOUR terms or taking him out of the home on his. And with the family already posing a lot of problems with an attitude of they will do whatever they want to do, then realize that they just MAY do whatever they want to, and may make themselves his guardian with you as his caregivers.
If you plan to raise a family in this, realize, as again Geaton says, that when you have an incontinent senior who cannot be controlled roaming about the house removing his incontinent wear, you will understand this was never a good idea. Geaton's message to you is so excellent that, were I you, I would memorize it.
Sorry for all of this; it could have been foreseen on some level I would think, but hindsight is 20/20 and we DO miss the forest for the trees.
Its time for DH to set boundries. Tell his siblings that there is no problem in visiting but they need to realize that he does own the home and now that he is living in it they must take in consideration that he has a small child that is used to routine so they really need to leave by her bedtime. He also needs to make a point that the house is also your home. Dad is now living with you, not you living with him.
You will find that as FILs Dementia progresses, he will get overwhelmed with this many people at one time and for prolonged periods of time. Especially kids running around. He may get aggitated easily. At this point visits will have to be toned down. It will only make his anxiety worse. I am surprise with his now anxiety and depression problems these visits already don't have some effect on him. If it seems to, DH needs to make family aware of this. DH handles his family. You will only be seen as the meddling SIL.
I have a feeling DH bought the house before you married. Been there. My DH bought and remodeled the house we live in before we married. His Mom had a lot of input on what cabinets were put in the kitchen, walls painted and coloring of carpet. She made custom drapes for a living so she made every drape and curtain. When I moved in DH told me the house was now mine to do what I wanted. My MIL had a hard time excepting my decorating. I found a print I liked and she had it framed for me as a gift. She didn't like where I planned on putting it so she had my DH hang it where she thought it should be. (It got hung where I wanted it) Another time we came home to find she had changed every candle in my sconces to a different color. (Yes, they were changed back) I am pretty sure my DH had a talk with her when he visited.
In answer to your question, I don't think it's unreasonable to want to keep your toddler in a set routine, regardless of who is visiting in the home. Unfortunately, I think you might be fighting a losing battle, unless BOTH husband and FIL join you in a united front against these family members, and make it very clear that this is your HOME and you are not mere visitors, as they are.
There is also another point I want to bring up. I'm sure you know what I am about to say, but I think it bears repeating. You post that these relatives have said that, in order to keep FIL from a facility, they would be willing to be his 24/7 caregiver. Please, if you haven't already done so, use other posts here in the forum as a cautionary tale and have a discussion with your husband to discuss and agree on a backup plan - because the chances of these relatives stepping up to be 24/7 caregivers - especially of a person with whom they do not live - are between slim and none. And then, I am afraid his care will fall primarily onto YOUR shoulders, especially if you decide to go with the stay-at-home mom route.
Good luck and (((hugs)))
I just feel sick thinking about all this now and how much it has escalated in the past week.
nothing was taken.
it's your house -- and for the past 10 years, your house.
i can look at another house across my street, and say, "i feel like that's my house."
that doesn't mean it's my house.
i can feel whatever i want - that doesn't mean it's correct. it's factually totally incorrect. that house across the street is not my house, nor is it my family home.
i can also look at my parents' house and say, "i feel like that's my house...or ok, i feel like that's my family home."
it's NOT the family home. it's not my house. it's my parents' house.
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this is not complicated.
the house belongs to you/your husband.
Repeat as necessary.
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i think there are details to the story we don't know.
a few things don't make sense.
purple:
--why did you originally refer to it as "MIL's home"? you yourself said you're living in MIL's home. you didn't say you're living in your own home.
--if your husband really owns it since 10 years, it's strange you didn't say: "we live in our house, when family members visit they're rude/disrespectful."
--as someone else pointed out, you wrote "we sold our property last year and moved in after agreement with the family"...why did you need their consent (you said the house already belonged to your husband for 10 years)? maybe you needed their consent, because it belongs to several family members?
--you yourself continue to refer to it as the "family home". maybe it did/does belong to ALL the siblings (your husband + his siblings).
That things have come to a head of sorts may actually be a good thing. Both you & your husband have come to see, really see, this house as YOUR HOME. So now it will be much easier to make those boundaries.
Heck, go paint the front door your favourite colour & scream it to the world!
I am SO very glad your Husband & you are together on this. You may not always agree on every detail, but talk it through & stand together.
I love my in-laws but they are Bossy & can be Controlling & Entitled too. (Capital letters needed).
Eg 1. I make a family plan & invite them. They attempt to change every detail.
2. Stating MY niece/nephew should be able to stay up late. (Overriding the bedtime I set for MY babies/toddlers - seemed to care about their own 'playtime' more).
3. Expecting to drop in when convenient to THEM (not us).
I was even told by one "I should be allowed to visit my brother in his house whenever I like".
What helped gain & maintain good family relations is boundaries. Just like the fences between neighbours. Too high & you never see them. If none, they run wild into your yard. Nice strong fences, with gates YOU control.
At first my DH had no idea what I was on about. Then he got it & we stood firm. Set our home rules. Simple really, just good old fashioned manners; Call before dropping in.
Visit when suits host.
Leave when suits the hosts.
And we return that courtesy to them.
Having a check out time gets very important (as mentioned) for those with mental fatigue due to dementia, illness or just aging.
The in-laws may be slow learners (umm 10 years - are they tortoises? 🐢) but with clear guest/host boundaries will get the message. They may grumble but really have no choice but to play by the new rules if they want to keep being invited.
The in-laws commenting "they will not place him in a facility under any circumstances". This is just being naive. Happens a lot. This will change. It's kind of magical thinking.
Maybe your in-laws are unicorn-tortoises? 😉 🦄🐢
You're nice, considerate human beings who assumed the best about his siblings.
The siblings may be boors (at best) or grifters (at worst).
Forewarned is forearmed. Glad DH is on the case.
You need to get your husband on board. Maybe he would like to take over all of the caring since your made to feel like an outsider?
Take the phone off the hook. Leave when they come over. Spend the night in a hotel. That is rediculious you have to put up with a cranky kid.
If the people say no they don't get to come over. I'd change the locks and lock them out. Maybe they will get the message. They don't get to tell you no.
You can always show up for a visit with them at 10pm at night. See if they like late visits. Lol.
That being said, assuming your husband owns the home (which means you do to, right?), you should not be "asking" people to leave earlier, you should simply state the fact that visits are to be ended by such-and-such time. Be very clear and direct about what timeframes are allowed for visits, and what pre-notification must be given before visits. If family will not comply, do not answer the door when they attempt to visit. If they have keys/access, change the locks and explain they are not allowed to visit if they refuse to follow time constraints put in place so that your child's bedtime can be maintained. Very simple. Not easy, but simple, really.
If these family members are on your husband's side, he should be handling this situation in the manner I described. If he refuses, you should consider moving out, if you have the resources or family to stay with, until he handles this situation. I know that sounds harsh, but this will only get worse until he is willing to stand up to his family in order to protect his wife and child. Make it clear in no uncertain terms that you and your child must be priority.
One caveat here though...you don't state how often they visit. What I suggest above is assuming they visit frequently. If they are only visiting like twice a year, then let it go.
Best to you.
Maybe they still think that it's the family home and your family are the trespassers/a free stay at the home. That's why they are showing up and staying late, and bringing more people in. Kind of like a dominance thing. Subtly letting you know it is not yours. That's what it sounds like.
What happens if dad goes into care? Are they going to show up with a truck ready to remove items? Maybe do it while you are visiting at the hospital, or nursing home. I've heard of these things happening before. Claiming your furniture as dad's. I'd get everything squared away with the husband. Then he can deal with the family. They won't like it coming from you. Does he have to buy them out when his dad dies? I'd keep meticulous records of your caring for him. Because they could take you to court over the house or belongings, or decide the money in accounts were stolen. At least if you have records of your caring for him, meals made, bed cleaned, bathed etc, Money used for this bill on this date. All kept on a spread sheet on the computer. Every penny accounted for. Any upkeep on the house/yard too.
This could become a battle after he passes. They might think you get free rent but bow you owe $ after he is gone. I'd get everything in writing and everyone to sign it. You wouldn't be the first person whose inlaws/family decide you need to pay rent, or move out, or because no money is left, you took it. You never know.
Are they just walking into the house? Get the locks changed so they can't come in when you are out.
Gold luck.
They want to come and go as they please then they can take care of him and see how that fits their schedule
:)
"This was presented as you and hubs/child moving into to "MILs home" last year to care for FIL, but then later you state your husband has owned the home for 10 years."
"Something does not add up."
i agree.
actually, there are several contradictory things in the story.
i think OP decided to suddenly say, her husband owns the house. and decided to say "10 years", so no one starts talking about the 5-year look-back problem.
it sounds to me like the house in reality, belonged to the parents, and still belongs to the parents, and OP + husband live there.
that's why OP + husband also asked for consent of other family members, to move in.
you don't ask for consent, if you own the place.
now, there are problems with the other family members who feel they can visit their father anytime -- because, i think, in reality the house still belongs to the parents.
that's why OP uses the expression she "feels unwelcome" in the house.
for this reason also, OP continues to refer to it as the "family home".
anyone who owns a house would right away say to a visitor, "this is my house! no, you can't stay beyond 11 pm," etc., whatever.
the idea that it belongs to the husband was suddenly mentioned by OP at a much later stage.
i don't think it's true.
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also, it doesn't take 10 years of house-ownership, for suddenly the topic to come up for the 1st time ever: husband speaking to siblings for the 1st time ever, "this is my house. you can't just enter my house whenever you want to."
no one in this world allows any family member (especially family members who actually disturb them) to enter their house at any time of the day.
Come on! Sounds like amateur hour on the Crime TV Network or something!
The OP made herself clear; she's living in the IN LAW'S home which they owned originally and now her husband owns for the past 10 years. MIL died and now they're care for the FIL. Now she has to defend herself b/c of accusations she's lying???????????
Stick to the question at hand instead of trying to cut apart the words being used by the OP to see where the 'cracks' are! That's my suggestion. Sometimes there's a post here that sounds fishy or off, that's true. But this isn't one of them, imo.
You note there are times you also think a post seems "fishy or off"...are those the only posts a person can question? If I don't agree with the one's you think seem off, should I contact you directly to scold you about it, or just post it in the forum with a lot of insults, virtual hand-slaps, and question marks?
Remember someone can write something one way, and another person can interpret it another way.
I have a friend, who has an elderly great grandpa. Family members moved in and took over. Caring for grandpa too. Other family members are thinking the house is getting sold after grandpa dies, or the guy has to buy the rest of the relatives out to settle estate. While the people living/taking care of the elderly grandpa, think they own the house outright bc they provided 24/7 care. I can see the storm brewing now. Seen it too many times.
i agree.
my comment is a general one:
there's a bit too much attacking going on here on this website.
--it's ok to ask questions. one shouldn't be attacked for asking.
--it's ok to have a different opinion.
--it's ok to be in the minority, for a certain point of view. (in fact, i would say, watch out if you're in the majority...one must be able to question oneself too).
none of us know THE answer.
somewhere in the middle of all these opinions in all these questions on the website, suddenly maybe the most bizarre, most attacked answer, turns out to be very useful.