The family is now intervening in my father's care. Now, what do I do?

Tgengine,

I told my dad that he could do whatever he could do. That meant him doing it, not directing me what to do. I told him I would not prop him up or bring him back.

He actually bought a truck, loaded it and moved. He made it very clear he would rather die in a Walmart parking lot, in his truck then be in a facility. I honored his wishes.

I think that our parents are free to make their own choices but, that applies to us too. I do not believe in steppin and fetching, jumping and accommodating them when they make it hard on us.

If he moves that far away, you can't be his solution to anything. You will be a sometime visitor and you should make this very clear to him. He should understand the consequences of his choices.

Best of luck, interference from family that doesn't do the boots on the ground work just makes a difficult situation even harder.

What does dad want to do?
Is he cognizant? Can he make a decision like this?
Are you POA? if not who is?
If he can make the move and wants to let him.
And if he still wants to move ask him what he will do if he does not like it where he plans on going. Make it clear to him that if it does not work out if he moves back it will not be in with you but to an Assisted Living community or Senior community (wherever he is safest)

How old is your father and his sisters? Why did he start living with you and why is he living with you now? Has he ever had a medical diagnosis of dementia, a test for cognitive impairment or memory loss? Does he have a PoA?

It is somewhat difficult to give suggestions without filling in some of the background.

If he is totally competent and has the funds, and if he decides to move, then I agree with the others that you will legally have to let him AND you work on not being his solution when (not if) it starts to go south. I agree that you don't help him move.

If his sisters are elderly I would try to reason with him that this will become an issue sooner rather than later and that you won't be flying there on any "regular" basis to visit him unless he puts up the funding for it.

But if you don't think he's cognitively competent, and doesn't have a PoA (and you are wiling) I would try to pursuade him to do this first, then get him a physical and request a cognitive/memory test. Depending on the test outcome and if you are the PoA then you will most likely be able to legally decide where he goes. BUT there's the issue of whether he can afford AF. Most states' Medicaid does not pay for it or MC, only LTC.

I think you're in one of those situations where you can get burned no matter what outcome unless you're able to really be at peace with him living far away once his sisters are unable to help or visit him and your Dad has no one remotely close to help manage his affairs and advocate for him. He may need to become a ward of the facility or the county/state.

You are not imagining that this is a tough decision. I wish you much wisdom and peace in your heart no matter the outcome.

You said it yourself, TG - ask your father what he wants to do. Has your aunt spoken to him about the idea?

Why has your aunt suddenly sprung into action, by the way? I wonder if it's because she's been hearing alarm bells and thinks it's time.

How is your dads pain? No doubt he is miserable. I would love to see you get a break but understand the worry you would have with him so far away and alone. Does his lady friend check in on him these days? How would your wife vote?

Do the aunts have children? I think if so I would talk to the cousins to see if they know what their mothers are promising. They may have the best of intentions but not truly be able to help your dad.

I hope you consider it for your own sake.

Tgengine, your profile says that you are married to a wife who is very supportive. If you wrote this last post, and your marriage hasn’t changed, it’s important to know what your wife thinks. Could you fill us in? Or update your profile, perhaps?

TG, it's up to your dad, isn't it? He's still competent, right? And you've often mentioned that he has little money of his own and spends his small SS on himself. Am I recalling this right? Where is the money coming from for him to live in a facility place? I don't think he'd qualify for a SNF, unless his condition has changed. My understanding from previous posts is that he's able to care for himself (hygiene, ADLs, etc.) but he can be self-centered and want others to do things for him. Based on that, I believe he would qualify for Independent Living or maybe an Assisted Living place and that could be a very good thing for him.

You've wanted peace in your house for a long time. I'm not saying that time has come, but it's up to your dad, right? You've done a great job caring for him. It's ok to pass the baton to someone else, especially if they're stepping up for the position. You can see if your dad wants to make this move and go from there.

I don't want to be harsh or mean, Ali, but TG's father isn't just on a low income - he's been financially irresponsible all his life and has never scrupled to ask TG to bail him out.

TG, it is *okay* to let other people help, you know.

TG, is this a Nursing Home that Aunt has found?

Does your dad qualify medically for Nursing Home care? His doctor would need to script that.

Is this a NH that accepts Medicaid? If it isn't in the state he lives in now, would he have to fist establish residence there?

If dad qualifies medically for NH care, are you looking for a Medicaid facility near you for him? Or near one of your sisters?

So to answer a lot of questions in one swoop. Thank you all for your comments. I have to talk to dad today. I talked to my wife last night. I will ask dad what he wants to do and what his feelings are. The hard part is he will tell me what he thinks I want to hear. For the back story I moved dad in 8 states away, he did not do lonely well and he couldn't afford to live on SSI. At the time he was falling. Our relatives are all over, some a few hours away from the facility, some states away. My siblings are one 2 hours away but cannot drive (cancer) the other 5 hours away (going through marital issues). My aunts are 1 hour away and 18 hours away. But one has to be realistic. They will visit for the first few months then go about their lives. Then he will be alone. I will be 8 hours away and have no place to stay when I am there. The sister with all the answers has cared for her sibling-in-law for years but that person has a trust fund and does not live or has ever lived with them so it is a bit of a different situation.
As for income, he has SSI that is it. No other assets. He will qualify. The facility is a fraternal facility which he actually did some construction work on years ago si he knows the place. The problem is they will take his SSI and give him $50 a month and pay for all his meals. Who will pay for his insurance and all the other bills? I am not willing to take on more expenses. his friends here won't go visit him at all (they are in the same boat). it will be a lonely place once the people he will meet start dying. that is a matter of fact in NH situations.
As for going there, he won't be living the high life, I have dealt with nursing homes for 10 years and out of state so I know what to look for. I have dealt with social security, NH paperwork, immigration ect.
He has made friends here, he is not as destitute as he leads on tho family, He goes to church every Sunday, lunch after, lunch with church people once a month, usually a gathering once or twice a month, Coffee with his lodge every week and lunch after, one or 2 lodge meetings a week and lunch or dinner with his friend 2 times a week. The man goes out more than me! He spends money like he has a job. He got income tax back this year and is taking everyone out for lunch or dinner every week. So for him to be isolated I am not sure where that is all coming from. None of the family has visited him here in 8 years except for a wedding and that was one sister and niece. No one else has traveled to see him. Yet I have had to fly him halfway across the country for his brother-in-law's funeral and drive him 7 hours for a few funerals and a couple of hunting trips (in the beginning).
I get it, he doesn't have the entire family around like before, but I am the one who left home and he followed. The issue he doesn't realize is the family is not back where they were before, they are scattered across the country.
I asked my sibling yesterday to have dad visit for a week so my wife and I can celebrate 40 years of marriage and I got a no. That was the start of yesterday.
My daughters are busy, one starts a new job and lives 5 states away, the other can check on him once a day but won't be staying for a week so I have no backup.
I deal with NHs here with EMS and I won't put him in one, to be frank, he is not ready yet. If he was non-ambulatory yes, he is having issues with stairs but I do not have $100K to put an addition on to my house (nor does he).
If he decides to pursue this it is a one-way ticket. I don't have the energy to deal with this. TBH it was a bit of a kick in the gut yesterday. Lots of guilt ('im good at that I am told).
I'll chat with him today when I take him to the barber and get his McDs. Oh, yeah, isolated.... he gets driven everywhere.
It's my father, I have to care for him because all everyone else does is spew ideas and no action.

TG, isn't there a Masonic Home near you? I'm thinking of the one in Connecticut.

Dad doesn't do lonely? But he's made friends near you.

Maybe he just complains about being lonely.

What was his complaint to his sister?

Consider sending dad for 2 weeks of respite care at a nearby AL for your trip.

Of course the nursing home will take your dad's check as partial payment. That's what they are supposed to do. Your dad will get the personal needs allowance. He'll have to curtail his neverending stream of lunches and eating out or you will have to pay.

I talked with Dad this AM, his helpful sister brought it up. He said it was her idea to go to the NH. I explained how nursing homes work and the consequences of being there. I also brought up he goes out more than me. He understands, he was trying to figure a way to get out of our hair. Didn't go much further than that. I have to figure out a way to make this situation easier for us. The biggest issue is us getting time away. He said he can stay alone for a week but we know that cant happen.
I'll just chalk it up to family sticking their nose in it and not wanting to lend a hand.
Nothing will change, unfortunately. If it were a medical or mobility issue big difference. I did advise him people will visit for a while but that will stop. I don't think he grasped the entire issue. Once I advised when the facility takes his entire check and gives him $50 a month, he paused on that tidbit.
I'll just ignore the family messages like before. I have an adage, "clean your own house before you tell others how dirty theirs are". Funny, not one of them is offering to come and visit with him while we get away. Not one!

Tgengine, I remember some years ago when you first began posting here, when your father had just come to live with you, when adaptive activities were a dominating factor as your family (and dogs, if I remember correctly) were attempting to accommodate his needs.

It was a challenging time for you, as I recall.   There was a sister involved, but I don't remember much about her involvement.

Now, it seems, relatives want to get involved, allegedly.   I don't have any good insights, but I think that the years you, your wife and anyone else sacrificed while adapting and accommodating your father and in cases compromising your own lives, should be more of a guiding factor than what relatives want now.    

I haven't read all the comments here as I usually do, but I do think that the distant relatives have their own goals, that your father would be lonely not only b/c he'd be away from his friends and his routine, but also that after a few months or so he'd probably be lonely for the companionship and the routines established while living with you.  In addition, you'd then have to travel miles away to keep in touch with him,

Another factor is I think this would be too drastic a change for your father; he's used to you and your family, getting to know distant relatives, adapting to a new facility, would be challenging, and perhaps negative.   I think he would decline quickly.   Just my $.02 worth though.

I've never been impressed with people, relatives or others, who become involved for what could be their own personal reasons, after others have sacrificed for years.

I think, as you said, this is up to your Dad completely.
Give him the details that you gave us that concern you. Tell him as you told us that you understand you aren't always easy to live with, and likely that won't change, but that you love him. Tell him once this is "done" it cannot be undone.
You do not say if you are the POA? I would not implement a POA if Dad is moving. Someone else will have to serve. It is difficult and I did it from half a state away for over a year, making it the more difficult.
Make it clear he will need to assign another POA to take over his care if needed, as you can't do that long distance.
I think also, try not to complain to the family. Between your own complaints and Dad's, the family may have picked up the banners and run with them. They are trying to be helpful and may have thought that both you and Dad are very unhappy with present placement in your home.
You are pretty honest and clear about the benefits and the drawbacks. You aren't a felon, so guilt is out of the question. You are a person smack up against your limitations. It is seeming to me like you were complaining, HE was complaining, and this is the net result of siblings trying to help him.
If Dad wishes to move, I would highly suggest he visit the facility with one of the siblings or with you before making this plan and choosing the place.
All I say comes with the caveat that you are not dealing with dementia here, and you are not acting POA. If Dad wishes to move I would help him do that. As you said, you will have your home back.
Wishing you the best. Not an easy decision and I think, perhaps much like you, I worry that this will get done and then Dad's complaints at the NEW PLACE will begin. So make it VERY VERY clear that he will not be moving back if this is done. I don't know what assets he has; they may get eaten up quickly in ALF.

Tengine, now is a good time to reset some ground/house rules with your dad.

Tell him. Don’t ask.

He has to contribute $$ for his share of expenses.

You and your wife will go out without him.

He is to pick up/clean up after himself as much as he physically can.

Etc.

Make it clear to him that he’s had it so easy so good for years on your expense.

If you just let things continue as usual, then this will be a lost opportunity.

Read your response further down. If Dad goes into a NH it sounds like Medicaid will be paying plus his Social Security. If this is true, he has Medicare and Medicaid will be his secondary for health insurance. If ur talking life insurance, if it has cash in value Medicaid will require it to be cashed in. I used Moms to prepay her funeral.

What other bills does he have? Once in a NH on Medicaid he cannot pay his bills. SS cannot be garnished. And...YOU are not responsible for those bills. Before I would move him to that facility, u may want to see if he fits Medicaid criteria for them to pay. You just don't put yourself into a NH. Your Dad needs to be 24/7 care.

The only way I see u getting away is to hire someone to look in on Dad or pay for respite care in a NH or AL.

There are HUD apt houses. They charge 30% of ur monthly income for rent. You may want to talk to Social Services to see if Dad would qualify for Supplemental Income if he goes out on his own.

Ignore them.

TG, you keep telling us how little money dad has, but he seems to go out a lot.

Is he running up a CC balance?

Shouldn't his funds cover respite for you and wife, either people to come in and check on him or a week or two in a facility?

Have you looked into the Masonicare facility in Wallingford? I believe they have Assisted Living. We looked at it for my mom and we liked it, as I recall.

Dad went to the mailbox for 3 days (never does unless he is expecting a check) to get the mail. Figured something was up. He intercepted the package his sister sent me about the facility. Never told me or showed me. My wife said he had it all spread out in his room. His way of dealing with it?
Been a tough week. trying to stay out of the way. Been very stressful and I am not coping well. My wife is worried and I decided after not getting much sleep to get some counseling. I signed up for an online program through our health care. It is a video call, which works better for me. I am wary of counselors. I did a cursory check of their info and they deal with some of my issues. I had to do therapy as a child due to family issues and school. Never been a fan of them but I'll give it a go. Need something to deal with the stress.
Asked my sibling to watch dad for a few weeks and I sent a text and no response. her way of dealing with the situation. So I don't get to plan a vacation this year. Funny, none of the sisters will step up and take dad either! Happy to dole out advice but not willing to help.

tg - first of all BIG (((((((((hugs))))))). This has always been a difficult situation. I am glad you have sought counseling. I hope it helps. Over all I have found counseling helpful for me. If one counselor didn't work for me, I found one that did.

It looks like dad is serious about considering placement. Earlier you wrote that dad was looking at this option to make things easier for you. I am surprised from what you have written about him before that he is aware and cares enough to look at an alternative. However, I understand your frustration with interfering relatives.

For me, distance caregiving was possible where hands on would not have been possible. A bright side - you can have vacations!

I am sorry your sis is not more supportive. I share that experience.

As dad is competent mentally, ultimately it is up to him to make his own arrangements. If he decides to go, surely it would be a relief for you and your wife not have the "blow outs" and other difficulties to deal with. Surely it would be good for you and your wife to have your lives back, your home to yourself.

Nonetheless, I understand that your interfering aunt has "thrown a spanner in the works" and upset your plans for dad's care. It's not easy to have some one else take control of something we have been in charge of.

tg - change is not easy. Take care of you and your wife. Something good may come of this.

Did online video counseling, wasn't too bad. More fact-finding background stuff. Got a few pointers that I knew what to do. exercise, eat better, don't drink, meditate, etc. Anyway, took the dog for a walk, and will do it each day (raining today) will have to set up the treadmill again. Tired meditating for about 10 minutes, that will take some time to get used to. Scheduled another appointment for next week. I know all the things she is going to say, maybe it's good I get to bounce stuff off her vs complaining all the time to my wife. The video conference wasn't as bad as I thought given the past 2 years of constant zoom meetings. I have started back to in-person meetings for my groups now, I'm tired of zoom, people hiding behind black screens and I'm not sure who is listening. Plus they are not paying attention to the meeting always looking at other stuff on their desk computer (I'm guilty of that too) I like seeing people in person much better but for the purposes of this, it may be good.
Anyway, trying to take time. It's just he does not communicate the way I do, it's always headlines or comments, or telling me what I am doing at the time.
Taking him for his MRI today and have to call all the doctors. to get his medical records to the neuro.
His pain level must be much better in the last few weeks since bumping up the gabapentin to 900 mg pd. He doesn't take the pain meds like he was.
Nothing is going to change on his end, it has to be me. I am the one who has to deal with all of this. The biggest issue is I am not really communicating with him other than necessary right now. It's my way of dealing with things. Trying to get the sibling to call back, will see how that goes today.