I have been asked to help relatives across the country determine how long they can afford IL and what the implications would be when either husband/wife has to go to a higher level of care, or dies. I am totally not qualified to do this and am not going to try to help and then mess things up through some innocent mistake! However, how do I guide them to the right source for help? In searching online, all I can find are financial planners that focus on maximizing investment income, or estate planners. I know there are elder law attorneys, but it doesn't seem like they do financial analysis. What sort of professional am I looking for? (For what it's worth, this is probably not a question about Medicaid -- they seem pretty well-off.) Thank you!
Lawyers are not financial planners, and they charge an arm and a leg before you figure that out. Don't go to them except for estate planning (wills, trusts, POAs, etc.).
After Dad died, we invested Mom's money pretty conservatively, and she had enough to last her until she was 110, which she missed by about 18 years. Nevertheless, through good investment advice, she died with more money than she started with, and after $212,000 worth of nursing home and medical bills, I'd say that was pretty good.
I am a Financial Planning professional in Canada. I have also take specific course in Financial Planning for Low Income Canadians and am an Elder Planning Counselor.
Not all financial planners take extra course work in planning for late retirement needs. But some of us do and work on a fee for service basis. We do not look to take over managing the assets, just do the planning to ensure they will last as long as needed as their needs change.
Do a search for fee for service Financial Planners in your area. Keep in mind that if there are state specific programs, that will be better known by a planner in their area.
If they actually have $, they likely have a FA or a bank officer that they deal with. I think that you just have to plan on going out to visit them for 10 days or so to do a “boots on ground” visit to see exactly what’s what. It’s amazing much much our elders can “show dog” for a couple of days, but after 10 days you’ll have a realistic view of the situation. Stay at their home if you can.
The reality on cost of care in a facility often leaves folks absolutely gobsmacked… that it could be 15K a mo per person for a SNF. They may not be at all realistic as to how far their $ can go. You have to go thru their books to see just what the $ actually is. Ahead of all this you’d set up an appoint to meet with their FA, their bank officer and perhaps 2 CELA level of elder law attorney. Maybe go in on a Wed so you have the weekend to go thru stuff and then set appointments the following week. If you want to be completely hands off in all this the atty can set up a fiduciary situation for them. The FA and bank officer too many have suggestions….. if their bank actually has a Trust Dept there will be bank officers who know which law firms does this type of work.
If there is no other family and you do want to do something to possibly help them, I’d suggest that as you live out of state, you might want to open a small account where they currently bank. Believe me it will make things easier if a couple of years from now, you have to help them with their banking as you are an existing bank customer. If they have multiple banks, that alone is something you can help them do to close and consolidate all to 1 bank (if feasible… if they should have old high paying CD, those they keep at the old bank) and get you onto all accounts and on-line access as a signatory (not owner) on the accounts and you become POD on them. Even if end up the CELA atty takes over managing their affairs, you can still be on the accounts. Being POD and having your own account here helps to pay for after death stuff too as the bank can flat move the $ into it.
Also look at their drivers licenses, if their state allows for them to get a DL that is a permanent ID, take them to do this. Most states have some sort of on-line application for this and can schedule appointment for elderly and handicapped. Try to do this, makes everyone’s life easier in the future.
Good luck on all this.
This aunt and uncle are big-income, big-spending type people. You are probably on-target in saying they don't realize the long-term costs of care. I just don't feel I am close enough to do it right, and I don't want to take it on personally. The steps you lay out seem very sensible, but reading this forum has made me realize the pitfalls of just saying yes by reflex any time someone asks.
I am thinking a forensic C.P.A.
Good for you for knowing your own limitations.
It is possible that a Certified Geriatric Care Manager can oversee this process.
Can you call the senior center in their area for referrals?
A great place to ask this sort of finances question.
Also, a CELA level eldercare attorney could be consulted.
Check sources such as your local Council on Aging, and also check AARP which is full of advice on this sort of thing.
Be certain you are dealing with .ORG organizations or .GOV and not .com which will likely lead you to those who get compensated for monetary vehicles and investment.
Be certain that the adviser is a "FIDUCIARY" and you might want to check for Licensed Fiduciaries in your area (for instance, when looking for my brother there were four in the greater Palm Springs area. These fiduciaries make their living not on investment advice but on managing the estate for seniors without family or friends to help them; they are often appointed by the court. For this reason your local Elder Law Attorney and Trust and Estate Attorney may have a list of these Fiduciaries and even advice as they have a list of them appointed by the Courts when an elder has no family.
I sure wish you good luck. I cringe when I think of this as so many elders are led right on down the garden path with predators advising on investing in Reverse Mortgages and risky investments of all kinds. It is scary stuff, and if your elders are interested in SAFE investments where the earnings may be less but there can be no losses, they need to make this clear.
It is difficult to decide things before they happen, including what will happen with elder care in the future and the costs of same. Also a couple cannot predict the kind of care one or both may need and what divisions of assets must take place and when. That is best done with the help of an attorney.
Being well off is a huge help. Start with an elder law attorney. My advice is get hourly advice as of late on Forum we are hearing of costs of 700 and up to see you enter the doorway. This is someone who is a shark taking advantage of things. Hourly advice should cost 350.00 to 400.00 and hour and it is unlikely to need more than an hour of time to speak about the future, what papers need to be done now, and etc.
When Lawyers start on "675.00 to see us, and depending on research needed it could be more........you need to run the other way".
Try to get good recommendations in your area.
Best of luck on this and wish I could tell you more; hopefully some such as Igloo are around and can advise on how best to find the right advice for you. Sometimes there are good financial planners who do NO investment, but can tell you a lot about the lay of the land in elder years.
PM me, and I can give you the specific company she works for, if you would like.